daily rumor mill #76 - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Aug 11, 2004

RE: daily rumor mill #76

Date: Aug 11, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Done Gone
"Thank you, Dr. Cranston. I guess I did erroneously generalize the kiss-up part beyond USM. My mistake. In June I presented the same time line to administrators and faculty where I am now (not USM). Their reactions usually involve a startle response, and then the gestalt completes itself when they answer for themselves the question at the end."

Done Gone,

I assume that this is the "question at the end" to which you refer (cut-and-pasted from your most recent posting): Who can be fired more readily? (a) Govt. Worker, (b) Tenured Prof."

Quite frankly, at USM these days I honestly don't know the answer to that question.

Date: Aug 11, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Lamont Cranston
"Quite frankly, at USM these days I honestly don't know the answer to that question. "

I'll offer that regardless of the institution, it's probably easier to fire a tenured professor than a government worker with that many years in the system.

But how about a private sector question?

Is it easier to fire a tenured professor or a member of the United Auto Workers union who has 17 years on the job? (No fair moving the factory to Mexico, which is the usual method for firing UAW members...)

Date: Aug 11, 2004

Dr. Cranston,

It seems that at USM and at an increasing number of institutions the answer is not clear and that the choice as well as the distinction between (A) and (B) are becoming more difficult to make.

That makes me think of another question.

Who has more freedom with respect to their work?

(A) 17-year Government Employee (B) Just-tenured Associate Professor

Follow up question: Do you think you will respond the same way in 10 years? 20 years?

(I started asking myself these things while at USM and am still pondering my answers.)

Date: Aug 11, 2004

Thank you, Invictus, for exploring this further. A private sector union employee with 17 years invested probably is more secure in his/her job than a professor (and has a much better retirement nest egg put away).

Your thought on moving the plant abroad makes me think of adjunct faculty members or instructors. If an MA is the lowest degree necessary to teach a lower division course and an MA will work for less than a PhD, why not hire the MA? (Sure, MA adjunct instructors will not typically produce research or economic development (sorry to use that term) or make the kinds of original contributions to knowledge that a tenured or tenure-track professor would make. You could hire Ph.D.s to write grants and pay them commission (hmmmm . . .))

Date: Aug 11, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Done Gone
"Dr. Cranston, It seems that at USM and at an increasing number of institutions the answer is not clear and that the choice as well as the distinction between (A) and (B) are becoming more difficult to make. That makes me think of another question. Who has more freedom with respect to their work? (A) 17-year Government Employee (B) Just-tenured Associate Professor Follow up question: Do you think you will respond the same way in 10 years? 20 years? (I started asking myself these things while at USM and am still pondering my answers.) "

Done Gone,

Good questions. At the present time, however, conditions at USM appear to be qualitatively different from the way things are at other major universities with which I am familiar. So I can't even venture a guess to your questions.

Date: Aug 11, 2004

A tiny quibble. As a university staff person and adjunct instructor some time ago, I was doing research, wrote, even made a conference presentation, and attempted to keep alive academically. Sometimes having a PhD is a function of money and life circumstances. When I quit doing academic work later on, it was because I did not have library privileges or, especially, the support and encouragement of peers. The library thing can be overcome, but the scholarly atmosphere is hard to get outside academia. What adjuncts cannot give the university is the service component, and the ability to mentor upper-level and graduate students, or the ability to draw others to the institution.

Date: Aug 11, 2004

Thanks, LVN, and good points.

Date: Aug 11, 2004

More questions:

Who is in the best financial situation? (A) 17-year Govt. Employee (B) 17-year union Private employee (C) Just-tenured Assoc. Prof.

Who risked the most to get where they are? (A) 17-year Govt. Employee (B) 17-year union Private employee (C) Just-tenured Assoc. Prof.

I'll add to this survey as I think up more questions. Guess I'm in a reflective mood today.

Date: Aug 11, 2004

Apologies around. I already asked the risk question.

Date: Aug 11, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Done Gone
"More questions: Who is in the best financial situation? (A) 17-year Govt. Employee (B) 17-year union Private employee (C) Just-tenured Assoc. Prof. Who risked the most to get where they are? (A) 17-year Govt. Employee (B) 17-year union Private employee (C) Just-tenured Assoc. Prof. I'll add to this survey as I think up more questions. Guess I'm in a reflective mood today."

Dog gone it, Done Gone, you sure are pensive today. Lamont is not available to respond at the moment, but I will try to respond for him. Lamont would say that. from a financial perspective and as a rule-of-thumb, over the long haul a public position is far preferred to a private one. But Lamont is very high on federal and state employment, and on pubic service employment, so his opinion is not an unbiased one.