Physical Plant on HA Forum - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Jun 6, 2006

Physical Plant on HA Forum

Date: Jun 6, 2006

lvn--until you mentioned it i had not. but, they have keys now, but they aren't outside people. outside/inside i guess i can't worry about it. i guess i'm a trusting person.

Date: Jun 7, 2006

Aramark, USM deal concerns workers
By Ed Enoch

http://www.hattiesburgamerican.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060607/NEWS01/606070329/1002

Date: Jun 7, 2006

Check out what is being said on the H.A. Forum. Here is the link:

http://community.hattiesburgamerican.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1149632134

Date: Jun 7, 2006

I'm having a tough time feeling sorry for the physical plant folks. They all vote Republican because the hate abortion and same sex marriage. Well, they've made their choice and now they've got to live with it. When they are old and broke and sick and don't have to nickels to rub together, I hope they remember the good old days. Be careful what you ask for--you may get it!

Date: Jun 7, 2006

What a silly, ugly remark. For starters, a whole bunch of the PP folks probably don't vote Republican. For seconds, some of the biggest "yellow-dog" Democrats I know hate abortion and same-sex marriage, since those can be religious as well as political issues. And finally, what does one have to do with the other? These people are not being treated right.

Date: Jun 7, 2006

LVN wrote:

What a silly, ugly remark. For starters, a whole bunch of the PP folks probably don't vote Republican. For seconds, some of the biggest "yellow-dog" Democrats I know hate abortion and same-sex marriage, since those can be religious as well as political issues. And finally, what does one have to do with the other? These people are not being treated right.

I agree LVN. I know quite a few of the PP folks. They do tend to be more conservative generally than I am but not uniformly so. I think that Aramark is just beginning to discover there are some pretty smart people working over there . . . lumping people too easily into categories is a sure route to underestimate anyone.

Date: Jun 7, 2006

Old Fashioned Liberal wrote:

I'm having a tough time feeling sorry for the physical plant folks. They all vote Republican because the hate abortion and same sex marriage. Well, they've made their choice and now they've got to live with it. When they are old and broke and sick and don't have to nickels to rub together, I hope they remember the good old days. Be careful what you ask for--you may get it!

These people DID plan for their old age by choosing to take a job with a good pension benefit. If they get hurt, it will be because of a decision beyond their control.

Date: Jun 7, 2006

Such baiting (by a writer above) should be completely ignored.

The state of Mississippi has a good thing going for it - the retirement system is top notch. I can see why people might want to stay in such a system, and I can see why some PP employees are horrified by being forced out of the system. Sure, they can try to find other state jobs elsewhere, but their homes and families are here and that is a tough situation!

They stayed on, though salaries were bad, because they knew better things were waiting. Now, those better things have vaporized. I can only hope that the more upset employees can find similar jobs at other state institutions.

B

Date: Jun 7, 2006

Before I get all steamed about USM physical plant staff losing their PERS pensions, what's the average pay rate for those folks. I can't imagine working for 25 years to earn a pension that's barely above the poverty level & doesn't include health insurance benefits, but I guess some people can...

Date: Jun 7, 2006

Invictus wrote:

Before I get all steamed about USM physical plant staff losing their PERS pensions, what's the average pay rate for those folks. I can't imagine working for 25 years to earn a pension that's barely above the poverty level & doesn't include health insurance benefits, but I guess some people can...

Thirty five years will get you 75% which is infinitely better than the zero that most tradesmen in this area get. Throw in 25% for Social Security and you have an attractive situation. A 3% match doesn't even come close.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

The Shadow wrote:

Invictus wrote: Before I get all steamed about USM physical plant staff losing their PERS pensions, what's the average pay rate for those folks. I can't imagine working for 25 years to earn a pension that's barely above the poverty level & doesn't include health insurance benefits, but I guess some people can...

Thirty five years will get you 75% which is infinitely better than the zero that most tradesmen in this area get. Throw in 25% for Social Security and you have an attractive situation. A 3% match doesn't even come close.

Yes, and don't forget the 3% COLA that comes with that pension. That is 3% compounded so in about 23 years the one COLA (13th check) will be equal to a years pay.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

If they stay vested in the retirement system they will receive benefits when they retire. The 13th check would still be there. Yes ,it would be less than if they were to remain in the retirement system, but it all adds up.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

History wrote:

If they stay vested in the retirement system they will receive benefits when they retire. The 13th check would still be there. Yes ,it would be less than if they were to remain in the retirement system, but it all adds up.

Yes, but a 2025 pension based on a 2001-2005 salary average is not very attractive. The pension works best when it is based on the four years immediately preceding retirement. These employees rightly sense that they are about to take a big hit.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

In my opinion, this "dead horse" has been kicked enough. Unfortunately, the outsourcing of PP is a done deal and nothing can be done about it at this point.

Some of the employees (like custodians) will receive a nice raise to $7 per hour on July 1st which is well deserved.

Yes, they will be giving up some good benefits. There's no much that can be done at this point, except wish them good luck.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

MUW outsourced its physical plant about a year ago. anyone know how it is going up there?

Date: Jun 8, 2006

A nice raise to $7.00/hour? That's only $280/week or $14,000 per year. Unbelievable. How can anyone support a family on those wages? Its about $5000 below the poverty line for a family of four.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

How much do you think staff people at USM make? The salaries are a joke. People have worked there for the intangibles, such as the long Christmas break, being able to take courses, etc.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

qwerty wrote:

A nice raise to $7.00/hour? That's only $280/week or $14,000 per year. Unbelievable. How can anyone support a family on those wages? Its about $5000 below the poverty line for a family of four.

Its called "redneck capitalism" - a holdover from dem slabery days.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

qwerty wrote:

A nice raise to $7.00/hour? That's only $280/week or $14,000 per year. Unbelievable. How can anyone support a family on those wages? Its about $5000 below the poverty line for a family of four.

And exactly what skills and/or education do the custodial staff currently hold that would make them more marketable than a $7/hr job? They could get a job working in the fast food industry making (in recent months) $8/hr, but that would be a 40-hour/week, 52-week/year job. I like my building's custodial staff (I know them by name), but to initiate this type of bulls**t discussion is nonproductive. Custodial staff is the epitome of unskilled labor.

As LVN points out, most staffers work at USM for tuition breaks for their kids, the ability to get free health insurance for themselves (and possibly a cheap rate for their kids/spouses), the ability to take classes for free, the relatively flexible scheduling, and the seasonal breaks in the action (summer/Christmas Break/etc.).

Your point about the povery line is not relevant, since it is not reasonable to assume that even the majority of staffers are single parents with three kids. Plus, the $7/hr figure cited was, I believe, for custodial staff and not for Physical Plant, etc. AFAIK, none of the custodial staff are claiming to be "overworked."

Date: Jun 8, 2006

staff wrote:

In my opinion, this "dead horse" has been kicked enough. Unfortunately, the outsourcing of PP is a done deal and nothing can be done about it at this point. Some of the employees (like custodians) will receive a nice raise to $7 per hour on July 1st which is well deserved. Yes, they will be giving up some good benefits. There's no much that can be done at this point, except wish them good luck.

It isn't a "done deal" until the Board votes on it.

In the meantime -- many in PP (and an increasing number of custodial folks, by my calc) don't think the are getting such a good deal. In light of the university's promise to not do anything that would not in in the best interests of the employees, it seems to me as though there is very good reason to not simply shut down and throw up our collective hands over this "done deal."

Date: Jun 8, 2006

I have one question for the readers of this message board - How many of you would work for less than $7 per hour if you did not have your education?

I moved back home a little over ten years ago. I knew I would take a pay decrease but wanted to be near my family. I did not realize at the time that I would go from making $10.50 an hour to $5.75 per hour when I was hired as an administrative secretary at Southern Miss. At the time, I had more than 15 years of office experience and had received a certificate for the completion of Intensive Business courses from JCJC. It has taken me the ten years to get close to making $10.50 per hour.

What would the world do without the custodians and uneducated employees of the world? A friend once told me that the big wage earners in the future will be the individuals who handle our trash and do the work no one else wants to do.

I have enjoyed my time at Southern Miss and look forward to many more years of service. But let's face it if it were not for the benefits offered by the university, how many of us would really be here in the first place? Be truthful with yourself.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

Staff, you really believe our benefits are good? You've got to be kidding me (and yourself)?

Below market retirement, HORRIBLE health insurance, low pay, etc. The only thing not better about the outsourcing for PP (btw, I'm one) is the vacation.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

Staff wrote:

I have one question for the readers of this message board - How many of you would work for less than $7 per hour if you did not have your education?
I moved back home a little over ten years ago. I knew I would take a pay decrease but wanted to be near my family. I did not realize at the time that I would go from making $10.50 an hour to $5.75 per hour when I was hired as an administrative secretary at Southern Miss. At the time, I had more than 15 years of office experience and had received a certificate for the completion of Intensive Business courses from JCJC. It has taken me the ten years to get close to making $10.50 per hour.
What would the world do without the custodians and uneducated employees of the world? A friend once told me that the big wage earners in the future will be the individuals who handle our trash and do the work no one else wants to do.
I have enjoyed my time at Southern Miss and look forward to many more years of service. But let's face it if it were not for the benefits offered by the university, how many of us would really be here in the first place? Be truthful with yourself.

Where would I be without a secretary?

Well, I have learned to be self-sufficient without a secretary/administrative assistant to help me out. I write my own tests, make my own copies, type my own papers, mail my own letters, file for travel reimbursement, etc., all on my own. I even buy most of my own office supplies and teaching materials myself. The only paperwork my departmental secretary handles is my monthly "timesheet".

You make an interesting observation, though. You say that you used to make $10.50/hr when you lived away from Hattiesburg. You chose to move home to Hattiesburg and took a big cut in salary to do so. That's your tradeoff: money for home. You traded $4.75/hr for the opportunity to live in your hometown. Maybe it wasn't worth it, but that's the choice you made.

There's so much talk about a "living wage" around here that is pure poppycock. If you want more money, then go get it. Just don't expect to make big-city wages here in the middle of South Mississippi. Yet I continue to find that there are posters on this board who consistently think that "all jobs are more or less equal" and that the garbage man's salary shouldn't diverge so much from other, "more academic" career salaries.

I'm here to tell you that when there are as few individuals willing and able to be garbagemen as there are individuals willing and able to be proctologists, then you'll see a rise in garbagemen's salaries. When good K-12 school teachers (who must have a 4-year degree) are paid a decent wage (say, more than $25,000/year), then we'll start talking about USM's custodial staff (most of whom have no college education??).

Date: Jun 8, 2006

Staff Also wrote:

Staff, you really believe our benefits are good? You've got to be kidding me (and yourself)?
Below market retirement, HORRIBLE health insurance, low pay, etc. The only thing not better about the outsourcing for PP (btw, I'm one) is the vacation.

If you think a 3% match 401K retirement program beats the state defined benefit pension plan, you haven't thought it out very carefully.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

Oh, I think about it everyday.

I think about how good it would be to be able to CHOOSE how much I invest, where to invest, and how to manage the investments. I also think about actually accumulating wealth and not ending up on the plantation. I think about leaving my children something when I pass.

Again, the only advantage we are losing is the vacation . . . and that a little on the ridiculous side.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

You can invest your own money in tax sheltered annuities right now. With the Aramark plan most of the money you are investing is yours anyway, not theirs. A 3% contribution by them is peanuts. The reason the state recently increased its match to 10.75% was to cover obligations to future retirees. That's a total contribution of 17.75% to cover the defined benefit program you can not outlive and a small monthly reduction allows you to cover a surviving spouse. That should give you a clue as to what is required for adequate retirement income.

As a practical matter most employees are not going to contribute 6% to get 3% and will end up at retirement with nothing. Currently, it is estimated that less than 10% of outsourced workers on campus are participating in the Aramark retirement program.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

That should be my choice! But I simply can't afford to contribute 7.25% and invest in something else.

My point is that there are some of us who didn't come for the so-called "great benefits" because they aren't and we never thought they were. We came because we wanted to work in this environment. And from what I gather from the dining folk, they like their situation.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

I spoke with a couple of PP folks the other day. One of them has already found other state employment at a higher rate. The problem is he has stayed her so his children would be able to go to college. Now with a child ready to start in the fall he is having to figure out how he will come up with the other half of her tuition. Some of the other individuals were trying to hang on because their age precludes them from easily finding another job. I think the administration thought this would be easier than what it has been I think they are surprised by the uproar. In many ways this could help the larger USM picture. Alot of middle income individuals have not understood the faculties issues because they find them elitist. This is an issue that the community is more likely to understand and is happening to individuals they are more likely to identify with.

Date: Jun 9, 2006

just a staffer wrote:

I spoke with a couple of PP folks the other day. One of them has already found other state employment at a higher rate. The problem is he has stayed her so his children would be able to go to college. Now with a child ready to start in the fall he is having to figure out how he will come up with the other half of her tuition. Some of the other individuals were trying to hang on because their age precludes them from easily finding another job. I think the administration thought this would be easier than what it has been I think they are surprised by the uproar. In many ways this could help the larger USM picture. Alot of middle income individuals have not understood the faculties issues because they find them elitist. This is an issue that the community is more likely to understand and is happening to individuals they are more likely to identify with.

As a PP person who knows intimately the details of the negotiated deal, the tuition scholarships are EXACTLY the same with Aramark as they are now. A fund has been established to ensure that an employee is able to take 2 classes and a dependent gets 50%.

This is also EXACTLY how it works with B&N and Aramark dining - just ask them. So there are PP people bailing ship without knowing the TRUTH! That just plain stinks.

The problem with the administration is they haven't done a good job of communicating with anyone really, but especially the PP staff. If they had, and the positive aspects of this deal discussed, there wouldn't be nearly the uproar.