We are not alone - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Feb 21, 2006

We are not alone

Date: Feb 21, 2006

Dr. Mitch, I can't help but wonder if all of those professors in the New York Times article obtained permission from their respective university administrations or PR offices to speak to the press. Please don't ask them that question or they would laugh in your face.

Date: Feb 21, 2006

A very intriguing article that we could discuss from every sort of angle. But one paragraph struck me as kind of poignant:

Jennifer Schultens, an associate professor of mathematics at the University of California, Davis, received this e-mail message last September from a student in her calculus course: "Should I buy a binder or a subject notebook? Since I'm a freshman, I'm not sure how to shop for school supplies. Would you let me know your recommendations? Thank you!"

Mitch is the psychologist around here, but something tells me that e-mail wasn't really about what kind of notebook to use...

Date: Feb 21, 2006

With all due respect,some of this lunacy is self inflicted. Whoever thought up the idea of having students evaluate faculty needs to be put out to graze. I'm a local small businessman and I'd never give my subordinates the privilege of passing judgement on me;nor should the faculty. You have spent many years learning your profession and you deserve respect. I am in favor of assessment by your collegues and superiors even though I know this has problems and limitations. Students should be treated fairly and firmly and they should be required to show respect for the professor and the educational process.

Date: Feb 21, 2006

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060221/ap_on_re_us/harvard_summers_7

other faculty sometime succeed in ridding themselves of dead weight. Real Wurl class university presidents know how to take a hint.

Date: Feb 21, 2006

Sigh...

I gave my first undergraduate stats test of the semester today. Allow me to vent. I had several e-mails and visits from students right before the test who wanted to take a "make up" next week because (a) they went to a conference last week, (b) they are a residence hall RA and had a rough week, and (c) they had a sinus infection. I give all make ups on the day of the final, and students who miss the first test in any of my courses for these types of reasons usually do poorly all semester. They were all shocked when I wouldn't cave.

Other students showed up and bombed anyway because they "... just didn't have time to study."

I haven't taught stats in 13 years, and I was shocked by all this behavior (call me Claude Raine).

I asked students to know a handful of really easy and related formulas down cold for the test(definitional and computation sum of squares, z-scores, pop and sample variance and sd). We went over these a zillion times, and they did problems and graded homeworks. We get to the test, and, voila, a good chunk of them left these answers blank (including students who have been coming to class). What is ambiguous about "you need to have these memorized for the test" (said over a span of several weeks during each class).

The results I suspect are, as usual, bimodal. Half B-A students and half D-F students. I already got the song and dance from one of my visitors -- he needs "to pass because I am definitely graduating this semester." And then he blew off the test.

Many of them cannot square four numbers and then sum them.

If the biggest problem UT or UC folks have is student e-mails treating them like WalMart Customer Service Reps, bless their hearts.

I can't wait til we get to hypothesis testing...

Date: Feb 21, 2006

Mitch,

I'm struck by how similar your post was to my own experience. I offered a few minutes in class today for students to ask questions about anything I'd covered for the next exam, which is Thurs. There was a lot of pressure for a "study guide," which I learned meant a small set of questions to study (prepare answers in advance) ...it will be an essay exam. there are only five chapters on this midterm. Ah...for the "good old days."

Date: Feb 21, 2006

Faculty want to share governance, but not be evaluated. In business you do not share leadership. CAKE AND EAT IT TOO!!!!

Date: Feb 21, 2006

opportunity wrote:

Faculty want to share governance, but not be evaluated. In business you do not share leadership.

Two out of three ain't bad, opportunity. But no cigar

Date: Feb 21, 2006

opportunity wrote:

Faculty want to share governance, but not be evaluated. In business you do not share leadership. CAKE AND EAT IT TOO!!!!

People just expect to be evaluated by those able to do so. As I posted the other day, I would not have wanted my classes from last fall to evaluate me, and I always participated in evaluations other places I've taught.

Mitch, you had the same shock I had last fall after not teaching for about 10-12 years. I was lucky enough to have a few foreign students and a few parochial school students, but many of my freshmen seemed to be visiting from another universe.

Date: Feb 21, 2006

LVN wrote:

...many of my freshmen seemed to be visiting from another universe.

So that's how USM is going to meet that 20,000 student quota? Puts a whole new spin on a "non-resident alien student," doesn't it?

Date: Feb 21, 2006

as i tell our TAs sometimes, you drew a bad hand this semester. just like in poker.

Date: Feb 22, 2006

I have seen an inordinately high number of emails from students this semester saying something along the lines of "I won't be in class today because my car broke down and I have to travel to Mobile to get it fixed." How they get a broken down car to Mobile but not Hattiesburg is not discussed, but my response is to ignore such emails. If they miss class (for a non-university-sanctioned reason) it is their probolem - they are supposed to be adults. Miss a few days on the job and see what happens. Such emails add to my suspicion that our students are pampered way more than I ever was as a student.

Date: Feb 22, 2006

Outside Observer wrote:

Mitch, I'm struck by how similar your post was to my own experience. I offered a few minutes in class today for students to ask questions about anything I'd covered for the next exam, which is Thurs. There was a lot of pressure for a "study guide," which I learned meant a small set of questions to study (prepare answers in advance) ...it will be an essay exam. there are only five chapters on this midterm. Ah...for the "good old days."

One of the biggest complaints I hear from TA's is the number of students handing in papers that have clearly been plagiarized. The professor explained plagiarism when the paper was assigned. The guilty students were given a second chance (how many of us ever got second chances on papers when we were in school?). The amazing thing is that over half of the original guilty plagiarized their work on the do-over. Thank heavens for the professor, who said, "Give them F's." The TA's also state they could write a great book on the creative excuses they recieve. I'm also amazed at how many professors and TA's also have to deal with e-mails, phone calls and visits from parents of college students complaining about grades or asking how they can help their children out.

I have a fourth grader working on a science fair project and I printed out some internet material for him. My kid told me, "I can't copy from the internet. I have to do my own research at the library and write it in my own words. Otherwise, it is plagiarism and that is like cheating."

Date: Feb 22, 2006

The USM Libraries tutorial on plagiarism is quite helpful. I require my students to complete it, and also to sign a statement on major essays that the work they turn in to me is theirs except where they have clearly acknowledged outside sources, though I also state on the syllabus what the penalty is for plagiarism at any level of the course. If any work is plagiarized after all that, they fail that assignment. If they plagiarize again, they fail the course. This is what I do, absent a firm university-wide policy, though it is probably just a matter of time before one is instituted with a central reporting system. Without it, dishonest students rather quickly learn that they can plagiarize until they're caught, and then say to every new teacher--as if for the first time--that no one had ever told them that they were plagiarizing. A centralized reporting system for any and all cases of plagiarism anywhere in the university would stop that ploy dead in its tracks.

JL

Date: Feb 22, 2006

I REQUIRED as the first homework assignment, that every student in two sections complete the library plagiarism tutorial and email the results to me (I set up a dedicated email account for students). Of two sections, at least ten students simply did not bother to do the assignment. I did give one F for the course for plagiarism.
What do you do?

Date: Feb 22, 2006

The faculty created this monster. When you give good grades for sloppy work, you reinforce it. Over half the seniors have a GPA above 3.10 according to the last Academic Council report. Something like 60-70% of all the grades given at USM are As and Bs. In some
departments it's more than that. Look in the mirror on the USM wall if you want to know who is causing irresponsible student behavior. You'll see some specific colleges and departments staring back at you. They know who they are.

Date: Feb 22, 2006

Mirror, Mirror wrote:

The faculty created this monster. When you give good grades for sloppy work, you reinforce it. Over half the seniors have a GPA above 3.10 according to the last Academic Council report. Something like 60-70% of all the grades given at USM are As and Bs. In some departments it's more than that. Look in the mirror on the USM wall if you want to know who is causing irresponsible student behavior. You'll see some specific colleges and departments staring back at you. They know who they are.

Good point mirror, but there's more to it than that. Organizational systems are in place which encourage this kind of faculty behavior. Numbers are important at many universities...revenue formulae are based on numbers of rear ends in seats. Teaching evaluations can't fall below a certain level...think about a typicaly state university class in which you have some really good students, some really weak students, some students who don't want to be there at all, many who don't want to do much work...then think about pleasing these various students groups to the point where you can achieve acceptable student evaluations. Is it any surprise that many As and Bs are awarded? Does any one ever hear about giving too many As and Bs? My guess..it's more likely that you'll hear about "giving" too many Ds and Fs first.