Online Evaluations Tricks - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Dec 22, 2005

Online Evaluations Tricks

Date: Dec 23, 2005

What a hare-brained, unprofessional, bush-league, ill-informed, unethical act! Certainly the professor wasn't acting alone or without guidance. Who came up with this ridiculous idea?

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Dome and Domer wrote:

What a hare-brained, unprofessional, bush-league, ill-informed, unethical act! Certainly the professor wasn't acting alone or without guidance. Who came up with this ridiculous idea?

When you can show me some predictive validity evidence that the specific student evaluations are related to any form of learning, then I'll agree that such games are inappropriate.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Exclusive of any validity to student evaluations of either teaching or learning, anyone who encourages participation in the process via extra credit should be suspect. I know this suggestion came from the dome and suspect you do too.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Dome and Domer wrote:

What a hare-brained, unprofessional, bush-league, ill-informed, unethical act! Certainly the professor wasn't acting alone or without guidance. Who came up with this ridiculous idea?

The administration came up with this idea, in a December 17 email to all faculty:

>Online Student Course Evaluations
>
>Student course evaluations are a very important part of improving Southern
>Miss academics. Please continually encourage your students to voice their
>opinions and participate November 30-December 30.
>
>In order to increase participation, incentives will be offered. Please share
>the following with your class:
>
>-Those who rate all of their classes prior to December 28 will be
>allowed to view their course grades during the period of December 23-28.
>
>-For those who do not participate, grades will be available starting
>December 30.
>
>-All students who participate on or prior to December 21 will be
>entered into a drawing for prizes.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

That's the toned down version, ot, and doesn't seem inappropriate to me because the incentives are not academic. An earlier iteration suggested offering extra credit. I just re-read the original post on this thread and realized I've been comparing apples to oranges anyway.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

jolted wrote:

I heard that one professor gave extra credit points to students who turned in printed copies of their submitted evaluations before the end of the semester. Any similar stories?

jolted, your story is not unique. This is happening in my college as well, and is being done by a brand new hire no less.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Is it possible the item turned in is the form which indicates they have completed all their evaluations? This is commonly done across campus.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Dome and Domer wrote:

Exclusive of any validity to student evaluations of either teaching or learning, anyone who encourages participation in the process via extra credit should be suspect. I know this suggestion came from the dome and suspect you do too.

Nope..I do not work at USM, nor do I live in MIssissppi. I do, however, believe strongly in the validity of performance evaluation devices.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

When there is no evidence of predictive validity (in this case, improved learning), and ratees lack confidence in the evaluation system, it should come to a surprise to no one that games get played. It becomes an exercise in "getting good numbers" since the numbers don't reflect anything...or at least there is no evidence that they measure anything...I'm convinced that, at least in some cases, the higher the rating, the lower level of learning takes place. At many regional institutions, student learning is not the top priority...getting the diploma and the grade is...so...teaching the test, rather than the subject matter, will get higher ratings...as will other sorts of games. The organization is getting the behavior it is rewarding.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Outside Observer wrote:

Dome and Domer wrote: Exclusive of any validity to student evaluations of either teaching or learning, anyone who encourages participation in the process via extra credit should be suspect. I know this suggestion came from the dome and suspect you do too. Nope..I do not work at USM, nor do I live in MIssissppi. I do, however, believe strongly in the validity of performance evaluation devices.

I agree O.O. But these "evaluations" are NOT "performance evalutions". In general the students give good teaching evaluations to instructors that require little from the students and give inflated grades resulting in lower standards. Instructors that require students to read, think and write rather than memorize generally get poorer evaluations.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

LeftASAP wrote:

Outside Observer wrote: Dome and Domer wrote: Exclusive of any validity to student evaluations of either teaching or learning, anyone who encourages participation in the process via extra credit should be suspect. I know this suggestion came from the dome and suspect you do too. Nope..I do not work at USM, nor do I live in MIssissppi. I do, however, believe strongly in the validity of performance evaluation devices. I agree O.O. But these "evaluations" are NOT "performance evalutions". In general the students give good teaching evaluations to instructors that require little from the students and give inflated grades resulting in lower standards. Instructors that require students to read, think and write rather than memorize generally get poorer evaluations.

Aren't student evaluations at USM used in the faculty evaluation process?

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Evaluations have been known to be "fixed" in there upon the chair's recommendations

Date: Dec 23, 2005

CISE:HATTIESBURG wrote:

Evaluations have been known to be "fixed" in there upon the chair's recommendations

Well...THAT will surely ensure validity.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

I'm a little confused. The "incentive" was for those students who did ALL of their evals online prior to the 28th, could get their grades between Dec 23 and 28th Those that didn't do all of their evals couldn't get their grades until Dec. 30th......however, I know of some students who were able to access their grades YESTERDAY (22nd).....and I'm pretty certain they didn't do all of their evals online If that's the case, it's sort of like offering a party for the 3rd grade class if EVERYONE behaves appropriately during the week, yet when the party comes on Friday ALL students participate, even those who didn't behave appropriately during the week! Kinda defeats the purpose of the purported "incentive".

Edward

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Outside Observer wrote:

LeftASAP wrote: Outside Observer wrote: Dome and Domer wrote: Exclusive of any validity to student evaluations of either teaching or learning, anyone who encourages participation in the process via extra credit should be suspect. I know this suggestion came from the dome and suspect you do too. Nope..I do not work at USM, nor do I live in MIssissppi. I do, however, believe strongly in the validity of performance evaluation devices. I agree O.O. But these "evaluations" are NOT "performance evalutions". In general the students give good teaching evaluations to instructors that require little from the students and give inflated grades resulting in lower standards. Instructors that require students to read, think and write rather than memorize generally get poorer evaluations.

Aren't student evaluations at USM used in the faculty evaluation process?

Yes, O.O., along with research and service, student evalutions are used as "Evaluations of Teaching ". It has been pointed out over and over with published documentation that this is not a valid way to evaluate teaching. The bottom line is the administration doesn't really care since they just need "objective evidence" that would stand up in court for their evaluations of faculty. It is just a way for them to protect their *sses.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

LeftASAP wrote:

Outside Observer wrote: LeftASAP wrote: Outside Observer wrote: Dome and Domer wrote: Exclusive of any validity to student evaluations of either teaching or learning, anyone who encourages participation in the process via extra credit should be suspect. I know this suggestion came from the dome and suspect you do too. Nope..I do not work at USM, nor do I live in MIssissppi. I do, however, believe strongly in the validity of performance evaluation devices. I agree O.O. But these "evaluations" are NOT "performance evalutions". In general the students give good teaching evaluations to instructors that require little from the students and give inflated grades resulting in lower standards. Instructors that require students to read, think and write rather than memorize generally get poorer evaluations. Aren't student evaluations at USM used in the faculty evaluation process? Yes, O.O., along with research and service, student evalutions are used as "Evaluations of Teaching ". It has been pointed out over and over with published documentation that this is not a valid way to evaluate teaching. The bottom line is the administration doesn't really care since they just need "objective evidence" that would stand up in court for their evaluations of faculty. It is just a way for them to protect their *sses.

Unfortunately, you are absolutely correct. And also unfortunately, there are many other administrations doing exactly the same thing. I suspect one day someone will challenge them on the grounds of age discrimination, although that will be a long uphill battle and I doubt that it changes things much overall.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Outside Observer wrote:

I suspect one day someone will challenge them on the grounds of age discrimination, although that will be a long uphill battle and I doubt that it changes things much overall.

What's your hypothesis here? No agenda, just curious.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Long of Tooth wrote:

Outside Observer wrote: I suspect one day someone will challenge them on the grounds of age discrimination, although that will be a long uphill battle and I doubt that it changes things much overall. What's your hypothesis here? No agenda, just curious.
My hypothesis...and observation...is that at some schools younger faculty tend to get better evals than older faculty...some older faculty member may some day file age discrimination charges....THEN, the issue of validity will become important...because if there is adverse impact against older professors, about the only defense is validity...(see EEOC Guidelines).

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Interesting, thanks for responding.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Outside Observer wrote:

My hypothesis...and observation...is that at some schools younger faculty tend to get better evals than older faculty...some older faculty member may some day file age discrimination charges....THEN, the issue of validity will become important...because if there is adverse impact against older professors, about the only defense is validity...(see EEOC Guidelines).

You are correct again, O.O. Young inexperienced faculty have been intimidated by the administration to get research money. They have much less time to devote to teaching and little experience. If they require less homework from students there are fewer papers to grade and more time for grant writing. Students love younger faculty who don't require much work. Older faculty remember what standards used to be and don't cave in to students demands resulting in lower student evaluations for them.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Related to this is the research finding that student evaluations of teaching are positively related to physical attractiveness.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Cecil B. wrote:

Related to this is the research finding that student evaluations of teaching are positively related to physical attractiveness.

This is true!! I was getting great evaluations until about the age of 56. Then they went down. I also noticed that the coeds stopped "hitting on " me about that same time.

The worst part was when ladies started opening doors for me before I could do the same for them.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Edward wrote:

I'm a little confused . . . I know of some students who were able to access their grades YESTERDAY (22nd).....and I'm pretty certain they didn't do all of their evals online

Edward, I'm a lot confused. Correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I read the system allows for some stuudents to receive their course grade prior to the time they do the course evaluation. If that's the case, the whole system is invalid.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Left -- your statements are very blanket ones. All the younger faculty have been corrupted and are lazy it seems. While older faculty are all prizes. If your views are that general and so little based in fact, well, happy that you have left.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

Somewhere in Ukraine wrote:

Left -- your statements are very blanket ones. All the younger faculty have been corrupted and are lazy it seems. While older faculty are all prizes. If your views are that general and so little based in fact, well, happy that you have left.

Ukraine, you have misunderstood what I said and generalized it too far. I didn't say the younger faculty were lazy. In general they are very hard workers . I said they are being force by circumstances to cater to the students. The students in general have little time for serious scholarship because they are employed, have families, etc. The pressure is on the younger faculty from both above and below to make things easy for poorly prepared students. Senior faculty are better able to stand up to these pressures. Nowhere did I say all senior faculty are great teachers.

My views are based on fact, and I too am happy I left. For what it's worth, I did received an excellence in teaching award before things went down hill.

Date: Dec 23, 2005

LaftASAP wrote:

Outside Observer wrote: Students love younger faculty who don't require much work. Older faculty remember what standards used to be and don't cave in to students demands resulting in lower student evaluations for them.

The problem that I've observed is that new faculty learned some bad habits in their quest to get good evaluations to get their first job. The learned to demand little, be the students friend, give As and Bs and reap the rewards. They start the tenure clock and the evaluations game starts over. Throw in some whatever differences in ethical standards and there you are.

My observation on older faculty is that they are caving at a slow rate. Same standards and grades as 20 years ago will get you canned one way or another. If you don't believe me just ask a recently retired science prof from USM. Most older faculty could catch up with the young with a higher class GPA.

A cute prof with a 2.5 class GPA will get kicked and an old fart with a 3.5 class GPA will win a teacher's award. GPA equal and the cute prof wins.

I for one draw the line at bringing goodies to class for the students.

Now go out and keep our RETENTION up.