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Post Info TOPIC: outsourcing physical plant?
Amy Young

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outsourcing physical plant?
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WDAM just ran a short story on how USM is going to outsource physical plant. This is a shock to me and I believe that the nearly 300 employees must be similarly shocked.

I was so impressedwith physical plant employees and their response to Katrina. They worked long and hard to get the H'burg campus back up and running. It was a process that I was lucky enough to witness firsthand.

I can't imagine how this will affect the employees here, their retirement, and the fact that I have always considered the folks who work here as partners. I hope to hear morefrom physical plant employees and from R.P. very soon.

This sounds bad to me.

Amy Young

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rose garden

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50 years old 18 years in the state retirement system.....i want to see SFT make this a "win/win"

it seems everytime i hear crap like this from the adminstration, i get sick to my stomach....maybe because i know i am hearing a bald face lie

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what a pile of garbage

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OF COURSE employees will lose jobs.  Some employees of dining services lost jobs with Aramark after a 6 or 9 month 'grace period.'   


If the university goes to outsourcing the physical plant, you can count on more expenses being charged to your departments --prices for services WILL increase.


What's next?  What academic dept. will be the test case for "outsourcing" certain classes?


 



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Skeptic

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I believe this was in the works for a long time.  Lassen has been looking at this since the bookstore and food services were outsourced.  Now with the lost of the casinos the state is in a critical situation.  Some agencies are conducting meeting with managers as I type, to figure out what to do when the money runs out.  Look for big changes in all government agencies over the next few months. 


Merry Christmas. 



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rose garden

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what are the chances financial services will be oursourced....real accountants, gaap, no funny money....a REAL CFO

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stephen judd

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Skeptic wrote:


I believe this was in the works for a long time.  Lassen has been looking at this since the bookstore and food services were outsourced.  Now with the lost of the casinos the state is in a critical situation.  Some agencies are conducting meeting with managers as I type, to figure out what to do when the money runs out.  Look for big changes in all government agencies over the next few months.  Merry Christmas. 


It may be possible this will save money -- although I'm inclined to agree with WAPOG above. Costs will trickle down.


Only two months ago the Presdient lauded this very same group of people for their dedication -- the willingness to go above and beyond. That isn't just about a job. That is love. And while some of our poorly paid staff folks with ties to the town aren't in a positon to choose another place to work, lots of people stay here not because they are paid well but because there has always been something about the spirit of this "can do" university and the people who work here that made it special. I felt that when I came here to interview in 98. All of these actions appear not to take that into any account. When there isn;t great pay -- there is always pride. These days -- there is little left of that, not with the way people are treated, with the loss of academic credibility we have experienced, and with an adminstration that seems to believe that the only reason people can be tempted to stay here is to appeal to their sense of greed, self interest, or survival instinct.  


Worse yet, this is another example of the insensitivity of this administration to its human resources and to the kind of human values that a university, of all places, should champion. Even if this move was necessary, there are better ways to handle it. Even if it is a charade, the idea of discussion, allowing people to absorb and reason and work out for themselves the reason for the change -- these things are important. When people are treated like furniture, they get angry. Worse, they feel betrayed.


I remind our community of the way the termination of the Deans was handled. The offices of various administrators and staff members across campus are redolent with memory -- not simply of the loss of good collegues--  but with the betrayal of human decency in the way their terminations were handled -- or mishandled. The clear message to everyone from Dean on down is that we collectively and individually are replacable parts. Now we have the spectacle of an entire group of physical plant people learning out of the blue that their lives are about to chnage and there has not been any attempt to prepare them for the shock and fright that any of us would experience in a similar situation. I don;t really give a damn if it happens in the "real world" -- no one has convinced me the "real world" is the better for it. Surely that kind of thing should not have to happen here.


We have been invaded time and time again by management types -- remember the Dvoracks and Hanberry? -- for whom the bottom line isn't people. It isn't even the institution. It is what they can rape out of the institution for themselves. When high placed departmental and college administrators threaten junior faculty by telling them to "take sides" in personal disputes (I know this to be true) -- we have been taken over by people who are in the wrong business. If they want to run over people, they ought to at least have the guts to go somewhere where that is the ethic that pervades the community. That kind of lust for personal power is misplaced here.  


I wonder if the upper management of physical plant knew about this -- were they even consulted?


 


 



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Skeptic

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stephen judd wrote:


It may be possible this will save money -- although I'm inclined to agree with WAPOG above. Costs will trickle down. Only two months ago the Presdient lauded this very same group of people for their dedication -- the willingness to go above and beyond. That isn't just about a job. That is love. And while some of our poorly paid staff folks with ties to the town aren't in a positon to choose another place to work, lots of people stay here not because they are paid well but because there has always been something about the spirit of this "can do" university and the people who work here that made it special. I felt that when I came here to interview in 98. All of these actions appear not to take that into any account. When there isn;t great pay -- there is always pride. These days -- there is little left of that, not with the way people are treated, with the loss of academic credibility we have experienced, and with an adminstration that seems to believe that the only reason people can be tempted to stay here is to appeal to their sense of greed, self interest, or survival instinct.   Worse yet, this is another example of the insensitivity of this administration to its human resources and to the kind of human values that a university, of all places, should champion. Even if this move was necessary, there are better ways to handle it. Even if it is a charade, the idea of discussion, allowing people to absorb and reason and work out for themselves the reason for the change -- these things are important. When people are treated like furniture, they get angry. Worse, they feel betrayed. I remind our community of the way the termination of the Deans was handled. The offices of various administrators and staff members across campus are redolent with memory -- not simply of the loss of good collegues--  but with the betrayal of human decency in the way their terminations were handled -- or mishandled. The clear message to everyone from Dean on down is that we collectively and individually are replacable parts. Now we have the spectacle of an entire group of physical plant people learning out of the blue that their lives are about to chnage and there has not been any attempt to prepare them for the shock and fright that any of us would experience in a similar situation. I don;t really give a damn if it happens in the "real world" -- no one has convinced me the "real world" is the better for it. Surely that kind of thing should not have to happen here. We have been invaded time and time again by management types -- remember the Dvoracks and Hanberry? -- for whom the bottom line isn't people. It isn't even the institution. It is what they can rape out of the institution for themselves. When high placed departmental and college administrators threaten junior faculty by telling them to "take sides" in personal disputes (I know this to be true) -- we have been taken over by people who are in the wrong business. If they want to run over people, they ought to at least have the guts to go somewhere where that is the ethic that pervades the community. That kind of lust for personal power is misplaced here.   I wonder if the upper management of physical plant knew about this -- were they even consulted?    


Excellent post Stephen.  You discuss what true management is all about.  At USM people are considered mere chess pieces to be moved around this great board in an effort to win a reputation for these "managers".  They need to impress the "business people" in town that they know how to run a business.  Giving an explanation and asking for input before decisions are made is a sign of weakness to these types. 



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Marley

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Amy Young wrote:


WDAM just ran a short story on how USM is going to outsource physical plant. This is a shock to me and I believe that the nearly 300 employees must be similarly shocked.

Was this announcement deliberately timed so that it would be announced just prior to Christmas?  

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Board Memory

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Marley wrote:


 Was this announcement deliberately timed so that it would be announced just prior to Christmas?  

Would you, perchance, be related to Marley's Son?

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Marley

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Board Memory wrote:


Would you, perchance, be related to Marley's Son?

Do you mean tiny tim?

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Board Memory

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No, there was once a poster on FireShelby named "Marley's Son" - evidently just a coincidence but thanks for respnding.

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Third Witch

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Just saw Lassen on WDAM. Faculty, he's doing it for you!! I'm overwhelmed at his sheer goodness!!

Actually, I thought I was going to throw up.

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out of towner

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Third Witch wrote:


Just saw Lassen on WDAM. Faculty, he's doing it for you!! I'm overwhelmed at his sheer goodness!! Actually, I thought I was going to throw up.

Doing what? His sheer goodness? Could you fill us in? WDAM doesn't reach this far. Don't bother about the "throw up" part. I think I know what that means.

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Third Witch

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He's promoting the privitization of all non-academic activities so that the wonderful faculty can focus on their teaching and research. No jobs will be lost. Millions in infrastructure will appear.
I kid you not. Maybe you can get it on wdam.com??

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out of towner

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Third Witch wrote:


 I kid you not. Maybe you can get it on wdam.com??

I'll go there pronto.

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Whatsamatta U

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Lassen on WDAM tonight could very easily had been included on Michael Moore's "Roger and Me"...Flint MI had the same kind of Christmas. Thanks Stephen for putting into words what so many of us still here are feeling every day.  There are those of us here, not because we have no other choices but because we choose to be here, have a shred of hope that our USM is worth staying the course.  Just when things get just a bit calmer, its the same old one two punch.  Why not outsource faculty?  Would solve all kinds of problems for this administration. Sound outrageous?  Does anything seem beyond this administration's ability to threaten our academic integrity?  I think not.

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outside in

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what is next to be outsourced?


First food, then cleaning, email is another good start, might as well outsource repair on all equipment.


After that office staff can be done by kelly girls. Then maybe finally they will get to outsourcing the admin.


 



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Mitch

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outside in wrote:


what is next to be outsourced? First food, then cleaning, email is another good start, might as well outsource repair on all equipment. After that office staff can be done by kelly girls. Then maybe finally they will get to outsourcing the admin.  


This trend will have, and has had, some unintended consequences. The on-campus price for the text I use has increased quite a bit. The "privitization" of on campus book services has changed my attitude from "let's support our university book store" to "hey guys, this is merely one option for getting your text, and it's probably the most expensive." Despite their location, B&N Corporate HQ is not a member of our shrinking "university family." Unlike the olden days, I therefore feel no loyalty or obligation to have students purchase my required text through them. B&N is welcome to carry it, and students are welcome to purchase it from them, but Greg has opened the door to a more market driven system. This has some consequences, both good and bad. 


From now on, on my syllabus, I will suggest that students spend some time shopping around for the best price for the books used in my class, and I will supply links to various websites that may have a better net price (after taxes and shipping) on the book compared to B&N (I will also select a text that seems to be widely available at a competitive cost). I will also indicate that students are under no obligation to purchase the book at the campus B&N, and that they are private for-profit business. I will also recommend buying a used text and selling it back to a vendor (again I will provide links and options), as in most cases buying new and then keeping an undergraduate text is a poor financial decision (and I'll explain why). I will also point out that student loans have compound interest, and that the extra $100 they potentially spend each semester over four to five years by not comparison shopping can end up costing thousands of dollars long term. B&N knows they can charge champagne rates because a large percentage of students will pay a premium for convenience (charging to one's account and so on), so I doubt that this will have a hit on their bottom line. But, having private businesses lease space on campus provides us all the opportunity to discuss the economics of higher education and personal finance with our student "consumers." Ironic.


If physical plant is outsourced, will local units be able to comparison shop and select their own vendors? I doubt it. The argument will be made, I bet, that we will get a better price if the winning bidder provides the same services for all. However, if the individual units' costs increase without the ability to comparison shop and select at the individual level, several things will happen. First, there will be no incentive for small local businesses to get into the game (which will reduce innovation and local economic development). Second, it will slow down the information flow that drives markets, reducing the probability that individual units will get the best service at the best price in most cases. Imagine that the Dean of College A tells the Dean of College B that he or she gets better service at a lower price from small Firm X. College A would switch to X at the next opportunity unless their current vendor responds accordingly.


I understand that the University gets $ in our coffers by contracting with big corporate names. But "privitization" in the way that it is done on college campuses does not increase the liklihood that the end consumer (whether a student or Dean) will get the best service for the best price. Neither does having the state run the operation (so that is not an argument against privitization). But, ironically, the former may lead to higher costs for the "customer" (students,  faculty, chairs, and deans) compared to the latter, as well as higher "profits" for the "broker" (the central admin) of the services. And, as we all know, central admin may or may not return this extra cash (that will come indirectly from our pocketbooks and acaedmic budgets) to the "customers"--the folks in the academic units (that's where the transparency and shared governance things that we all keep asking for come in).   



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Amy Young

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Third Witch wrote:

He's promoting the privitization of all non-academic activities so that the wonderful faculty can focus on their teaching and research. No jobs will be lost. Millions in infrastructure will appear.
I kid you not. Maybe you can get it on wdam.com??




Mr. Lassen may have what he considers the best interest of the university in mind, but there is a part of me that the money that will appear in the university coffers is something like voodoo economics.

I'd also like to comment that we are already "outsourcing" faculty by hiring more adjuncts and instructors. This might sound like good sense (cents?) because SACS requires basic minimums to teach, but in reality, hurts the student. Adjunct and instructors don't advise students. Adjuncts and instructors are not motivated to motivate and challenge students because they may never come into contact with any particular student again. Adjuncts and instructors who move quickly in and out of the USM system will not be subject to annual reviews of teaching where each year we review what we've done and work to improve on our methods. Adjuncts and instructors will not serve on SACS committees or NCATE committees or do any other type of service for the university. Adjuncts and instructors will never include students in research projects (because they don't do research). Adjuncts and instructors will not go above and beyond the call of duty to benefit the students and the university that they love.

I can only ask how outsourcing physical plant will affect the university like outsourcing faculty?

Again, I would like to complement the employees of physical plant who worked so hard to get this university back on its feet after Katrina. I know they left their own damaged homes and worked extraordinarily hard for the benefit of the students and the university which I believe they must love.

Amy Young

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Thinking out of the Box Seats

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What about outsourcing the athletic program?


Wouldn't that save the university $4-5 million or so?



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LOCAL

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It is my understanding that this was A. Dvorak's suggestion to SFT prior to the hiring of Lassen.  Powerful ain't she?

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Oliver

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Thinking out of the Box Seats wrote:


What about outsourcing the athletic program? Wouldn't that save the university $4-5 million or so?

Maybe the N.O. Saints are up for grabs. But we might have to travel to a distant location to see our games.

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astonished

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Excellent post, Mitch.  As an addition to your remarks, I have heard that the bookstore at Ole Miss was outsourced after the faculty voted overwhelmingly not to do so.  When the faculty started doing just as Mitch has advocated, noting on their syllabus alternative sources for texts, the new bookstore management pointed out a clause in their contract that prohibits faculty from advocating alternative sourcing.  Wonder if that is in our contract?


As for the required materials that must be purchased at the bookstore by those on financial aid, the same rumor cited above notes that at those institutions with a significant portion of their students on federal financial aid, the textbook prices are higher.  Anyone has any substantiated info on that?


Let it be noted that I have no personal knowledge of either of the above items, but the sources has been quite reliable in the past.



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HR 101

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One of trickier parts of management is to know when outsourcing works and when it doesn't.  Thankfully we are on the back side of the curve and should be able to profit from the experience of others.  It appears that ousourcing food service can work.  A lot of schools have done so and few, if any, are returning to an internal system.  The bookstore is another matter.  This doesn't seem to be working well and some schools have "reacquired" the operation after B&Ns contract expired.  I honestly haven't heard of outsourcing physical plant.  I'm suspicious though.  We all know of our favorite beautiful campus.  Wonder how many of these gems have outsourced maintainence?  I'm not sure you can get that level of clean, well maintained, and almost manicured look with employees that have no real connection to the university.


Its a moot point though.  If someone comes up with some upfront cash for the contract, its a done deal.  I don't think Mr. Lassen was throwing up a trial balloon.



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LVN

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I noticed that Mr. Lassen was careful to leave himself an "out" if the idea didn't fly -- I wonder if even he realizes what a truly stupid idea it is, but was compelled to put it forward.

Let's also remember that Physical Plant includes skilled trades as well as grounds, and housekeeping. Have you hired a plumber, painter or carpenter lately? How much did you pay them? There's no way outside people can provide service cheaper than inside. I recall that USM had an HVAC position posted on the job board for a YEAR, probably because it just didn't pay enough to attract anyone.

As for cheaper housekeeping, that's not cheap either. The going rate in my mom's neighborhood is $20 hr, yardwork is $30, and that's not an upscale part of town.

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Mitch

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astonished wrote:


I have heard that the bookstore at Ole Miss was outsourced after the faculty voted overwhelmingly not to do so.  When the faculty started doing just as Mitch has advocated, noting on their syllabus alternative sources for texts, the new bookstore management pointed out a clause in their contract that prohibits faculty from advocating alternative sourcing.  Wonder if that is in our contract?

Wow. If that is true, we would be put in the awkward position of knowing that we can make the academic lives of our students better, but not being able to do so for the sake of a buck. Would anyone else be uncomfortable with this?

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Bill Powell

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See Gregg Lassen's comments in an article in University Business entitled "Is outsourcing right for you" at http://www.universitybusiness.com/page.cfm?p=722. Read further on for comments on the need for campus buy-in.



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Reporter

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USM to outsource physical plant operation
By Rachel Leifer                                 http://www.hattiesburgamerican.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051202/NEWS01/512020303/1002



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qwerty

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Mitch wrote:

outside in wrote:
what is next to be outsourced? First food, then cleaning, email is another good start, might as well outsource repair on all equipment. After that office staff can be done by kelly girls. Then maybe finally they will get to outsourcing the admin.  





I have, for years, included language on my syllabus indicating that books are available at half.com, amazon.com, alibris.com and the university bookstore.

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LVN

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How could a faculty member be bound by such a contract? When I taught, I did not sign an agreement to only promote one book purveyor. Can I be bound by an agreement administration made with Barnes & Noble, an agreement to which I am not a party?

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