Pood Follies II - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Oct 3, 2005

RE: Pood Follies II

Date: Oct 3, 2005

Watching the Watcher wrote:

Coast Watcher, While Malone was out of line to question the instructor's students as he did, he did not and does not need her permission to do that. The students do not belong to her, nor does the room they were in. Administration has the right to investigate allegations of improper conduct in class by faculty.

What sophomoric bosh! The students and the room don't "belong" to El Pood or the Dome Gnome or the University or the people of the state of Mississippi either. What that space and those students actually are, Watcher Watcher, is a focal point of the millenium long conversation on the shape and nature of human knowledge that constitutes the real university. Violate that space often enough--regardless of how "legitimate" your ostensible reason--and you're on your merry way to the destruction of everything good about a liberal bourgeois democracy. Given the central role of free speech and academic freedom in the pantheon of human values, only the most pathetically incompetent, or perhaps the most cynically disingenuous, administrator would attempt to describe that conversation, that space in terms of property rights.

As for particulars, Malone wasn't even in the academic line of authority. Elliot Pood made no attempt to converse with Dr. Stevenson before giving Malone the go ahead. And there has never been any attempt to clear up what actually transpired. To have high ranking administrators show up unannounced and interrogate one's students approaches the acme of possible violations of academic free speech. One would think that such an instrusion would only be warranted if the professor in question were literally dangerous, or stark raving mad, threatening the safety of his/her students. Elliot Pood, however, that great stinking pile of pusillanimous puss, did it without making even the most cursory attempt to ascertain the facts of the situation. He did not speak with the professor in question beforehand. He did not "investigate" in a manner consistent with the protocols of rational inquiry. He acted hastily on third hand information--what students had allegedly told other professors--and then he tried to bully his way through the uproar by lying in public, repeatedly, about the whole thing, all the while sanctimoniously swathing himself in the mantle of duly constituted authority. My gorge rises just to think back on it . . .

I don't think I'm alone when I say that I feel the man to be a disgrace to the College, a disgrace to the very notion of a genuine university. The Committee A inquiry into "The Gulf Coast Incident" needs to be concluded and its findings circulated in the proper circles. The Ball State AAUP should know what they're getting into.

Date: Oct 4, 2005

No matter how many times you make the feeble effort to "defend academic freedom," you only serve to show your elitist attitude further. "Academic line of authority?" What nonsense! It is well-known that KM answered directly to SFT and that KM was SFT's right-hand man on the coast. In that sense, anyone with one-quarter of a brain knew that KM was acting as an extension of SFT. So any reasonable person would have known that KM was simply doing what he was told to do by SFT.

The idea [often perpetuated here] that no professor has a "boss" is ridiculous. Professors need to be put back in line, and this woman was clearly out of line. Using university politics in class is low class and is a blatant attempt to turn students against university officials and authority in general. Like a bunch of freeze-dried hippies, professors have taken up the mantle of "sticking it to the man,'" and they [the professors] have only succeeded in making themselves look bitter in the eyes of students.

It's none of your business or my business what Pood does, and calling Ball State to wreck his chances at that job is the ultimate in penny-ante bulls#it that seems to emanate from the LAB like stink from a port-o-potty. If BSU does its due diligence, it will find out the facts. If not, then BSU will have to deal without those facts.

As another thought, I believe there is a real fear that outsiders may view Pood as an acceptable candidate even when given all the facts. If this were true, then it would seem to indicate that it is the AAUP-USM party line, and not the Pood party line, that is totally out-of-sync with the mainstream. Such a revelation should rightly shake the AAUP-USM to its core.

Of course, given the new slate of officers just elected, what else could one expect other than a new AAUP requirement to pledge allegience to the nut-job flag?

Date: Oct 4, 2005

Watching the Watcher,

Huh??

Date: Oct 4, 2005

Pood's competition update

http://www.bsudailynews.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2005/10/04/4342208f44aa2

Provost candidate withdraws
Gora hopes to pick from remaining two within next 10 days

Emily Ortman | News Editor
October 04, 2005

Andrew Bodman, provost at Western Washington University, withdrew from consideration for the position of provost at Ball State University.

President Jo Ann Gora said a candidate withdrawing from a search is not unusual.

“It means we have one fewer candidate to consider,” she said. “I don’t have any profound statement to make.”...

...Gora said she hopes to make a final decision in the next ten days on whether to appoint William Swart, professor of decision sciences at East Carolina University, or Elliott Pood, dean of the College of Arts and Letters at Southern Mississippi University....

...Pood declined to comment, and Swart said he hadn’t heard about Bodman dropping out yet, and he didn’t have an opinion on the matter.

“Individuals apply for these positions for a number of reasons and many of them are personal or professional,” Swart said. “I think regardless of the number of candidates my hope and expectation is that the best person for the job is selected.”

Date: Oct 4, 2005

The academy has lines of authority just like any other organization. In the academy, professors answer to the dean, the dean to the provost. That's the "chain of command." Professor Malone was not part of that chain and it was totally inappropriate for him to inject himself into that situation. This is true regardless of what Professor Stevenson may or may not have said to her students. It was the dean's and the provost's job to deal with her, OUTSIDE of her classroom. For any administrator to invade a classroom and quiz students, much less harangue the instructor in the hearing of the students, is totally unacceptable behavior, and Professor Malone was totally out of line in doing so.

Many years ago my undergraduate advisor was arrested, removed from campus in handcuffs, and later convicted of a horrible offense. None of this was done in the presence of students or during a class. I can't imagine that Dr. Stevenson's situation could not have been handled with at least that much dignity.

Date: Oct 4, 2005

LVN wrote:

The academy has lines of authority just like any other organization.

Another way to state this is that "chief operational officer" (whatever that means) is not a term for "instructional administrator." Oops. I forgot: a degree in polymer science qualifies a person to do anything they d@mn well please. Still, I'm not altogether sure the Bot could get a job teaching general chemistry at PRCC...

Date: Oct 4, 2005

Watching the Watcher wrote:

It's none of your business or my business what Pood does

It is certainly the faculty's business if the adminstrators don't abide by university policy or if they violate ethical academic behavior. Most well-run universities have policies to handle student grievances, faculty grievances, and adminstrators' problems with faculty. Thames, Pood, Malone, etc. are not allowed to make their own rules any more than Enron or Worldcom is.

Date: Oct 4, 2005

My fingers are crossed for EP. Good luck, Elliott! I hope you get the job.

Date: Oct 5, 2005

If Pood leaves, lets recommend Frank Glamser for the position. I understand he's available, and he does understand faculty governance.

Date: Oct 5, 2005

Watching the Watcher wrote:

Coast Watcher, While Malone was out of line to question the instructor's students as he did, he did not and does not need her permission to do that. The students do not belong to her, nor does the room they were in. Administration has the right to investigate allegations of improper conduct in class by faculty. Malone's error was in the manner he chose to pursue that investigation, not in undertaking the investigation itself. There are limits to free speech and to the so-called "academic speech" that is highly touted here. I await the day when professors will return to teaching their subjects and will cease using their courses as pulpits for preaching political views and railing against those they dislike personally. I heard a story today about an Iraqi who won a scholarship to a U.S. university here in the continental U.S. He withdrew after 1 semester because his professors were preaching anti-U.S. thought and were attempting to make him ashamed to be liberated from Saddam Hussein's regime. He said he'd rather give up the opportunity than to be brainwashed into hating the U.S. I say good for him. It's too bad students don't demand the removal of professors who continually digress from their subjects to bash a particular political view, religious view, or other way of thinking.

There might be some room for discussion here if 1) you cited the source of the Iraqui story (it is really hard to respond to a general "I heard . . . " with much energy.) I need a bit of a context to know if this is an isolated incident or is, in fact, an issue that pervades the academy. I could repeat similar stories about academics who have used the classroom to voice support for the war. But generally speaking, and particularly compared to the Vietnam era when I went to school, stories of faculty members using the classroom as a forum for propagandizing their own students are really pretty rare considering the sheer number of classes taught each day in this country.

Your citation of the Stephen's incident would also be more convincing if I believed that you knew her version of the issue -- in which she clearly sets out her view of how the class discussion started and how she believed the subject was germane to the class. You might disagree that it was germane in your view, but in fact the issue is what she considered germane. To my knowlege, the administration has not proceded against her on the basis of her using the issue to exploit a political point of view -- which would clearly be its perogative if it believed she had done.

Elliot Pood and I have had a running conversation about the very issue of what constitutes a teacher's "subject" -- we have differing points of view. But even he concedes that there is great latitude for disagreement here and the need for latitude is extremely important to maintaining the classroom to be a place where ideas may be approached, discussed and developed with as few constraints as possible. Particularly in the humanities, where the presupposition tends to be that there are innumeriable relationships both known and unknown in the world of ideas, the philosophy that each "subject" is atomized would be extremely detrimental to the exploration of thought. And literature, of all areas, is certainly not simply about "writing" per se -- writing is always about something. So you cannot talk about writIng without touching upon all kinds of ideas -- and the best teachers frequently tap the things they know will provoke energetic response. Can this be abused? Yes. But apparently the majority of the class did not feel that Diane violated her responsibility here -- and niether, apparently, does the administration.

So generally, I have to say that the two incidents you cite to support widespread abuse by university faculty of the classroom are pretty poor examples as they stand. I wonder if your Iraqi example can be brought beyond the merely anecdotal to the more specific? THAT would be helpful.

Date: Oct 5, 2005

foot soldier wrote:

Watching the Watcher wrote: It's none of your business or my business what Pood does

It is certainly the faculty's business if the adminstrators don't abide by university policy or if they violate ethical academic behavior. Most well-run universities have policies to handle student grievances, faculty grievances, and adminstrators' problems with faculty. Thames, Pood, Malone, etc. are not allowed to make their own rules any more than Enron or Worldcom is.

Nice use of a quote out of context. My statement about it being none of our business was in reference to his job search, not his administrative actions. It's not your business to put the kabash on his candidacy at BSU, and the collective here at the AAUP message board would be totally hypocritical if such action were taken. As was stated earlier, if it's not OK to "out" certain faculty or to "out" Doty, then it's not OK to "out" Pood. Period.

Date: Oct 5, 2005

Oh, we're already down to the "you're quoting me out of context" stage, eh?

That said, I would think based on what I've read on this board that the majority of folks in CoAL would be tickled pink if Dean Pood got another job. I'm surprised folks aren't writing glowing "letters of recommendation" for him at this very moment.

(I note also that Dean Doty took his lumps in this forum when he was job shopping last year...)

Date: Oct 5, 2005

Invictus wrote:

Oh, we're already down to the "you're quoting me out of context" stage, eh?

That said, I would think based on what I've read on this board that the majority of folks in CoAL would be tickled pink if Dean Pood got another job. I'm surprised folks aren't writing glowing "letters of recommendation" for him at this very moment.

(I note also that Dean Doty took his lumps in this forum when he was job shopping last year...)

I didn't mean to insinuate that folks don't want Pood to leave, and Doty did take his lumps last year (and will probably take more this year if news about a job search surfaces). However, if you're going to chastize CoBers for publicizing Doty's search, then some criticism is due for putting Pood's stuff on this board.

Date: Oct 5, 2005

Watching the Watcher wrote:

However, if you're going to chastize CoBers for publicizing Doty's search, then some criticism is due for putting Pood's stuff on this board.

I think if it is on Ball State's website, it is public knowledge. It's not as if anyone has put anything here that most of us couldn't have found for ourselves if we'd been interested enough to look.

Date: Oct 5, 2005

Okay, so all the stuff about the English class notwithstanding, are you saying (most of you) that you DO, or DO NOT, want Elliott Pood to go to BSU? A friend from graduate school who is there now says Pood said in response to a question about things he's learned as an administrator something about taking more time before acting and how last year he allowed himself to act rashly and would not do that again. I assume he was talking about the Stevenson incident. So he says he's learned and won't do it again. Why (try to) stop him from going to BSU unless you actually want him to remain here?

Date: Oct 5, 2005

foot soldier wrote:

Watching the Watcher wrote:

However, if you're going to chastize CoBers for publicizing Doty's search, then some criticism is due for putting Pood's stuff on this board.

I think if it is on Ball State's website, it is public knowledge. It's not as if anyone has put anything here that most of us couldn't have found for ourselves if we'd been interested enough to look.

Yes, Pood's candidacy was publicized on the BSU website, much as Doty's candidacy was publicized on the North Florida website. The situations are quite parallel, yet the hypocrisy remains with respect to Pood. If it's wrong to "out" people, then it's wrong to "out" people, no matter who it is.

Date: Oct 5, 2005

so I'm confused wrote:

Okay, so all the stuff about the English class notwithstanding, are you saying (most of you) that you DO, or DO NOT, want Elliott Pood to go to BSU? A friend from graduate school who is there now says Pood said in response to a question about things he's learned as an administrator something about taking more time before acting and how last year he allowed himself to act rashly and would not do that again. I assume he was talking about the Stevenson incident. So he says he's learned and won't do it again. Why (try to) stop him from going to BSU unless you actually want him to remain here?

The confusion pointed at here reflects the ethical paradox that we're in vis a vis our AAUP brothers and sisters at Ball State, who gave Pood the thumbs up as a viable provost candidate. However, as we know, Elliot Pood figured prominently in an incident that could quite conceivably be classified as a violation of one of the AAUP central principles: the defense of academic freedom. Could the leadership of the USM-AAUP chapter report about the status of the Committee A investigation? I can't seem to bring up the AAUP-USM website front page, where the Gulf Coast Incident was prominently headlined for most of this year.

And finally, to cut to the crux of the biscuit, I again ask, "Do we not have an ethical responsibility to inform the Ball State AAUP chapter of what is currently known about the Gulf Coast incident?" Certainly we all want to be shed of the current CoaL dean, but if to do so we have to act unethically--by failing to discharge our professional responsibility to another AAUP chapter--we might be doing considerable harm to the credibility of the USM AAUP, and, by extension, to the cohesion of the entire national organization. This is really something for the leadership to consider, isn't it?

Date: Oct 5, 2005

Watching the Watcher wrote:

However, if you're going to chastize CoBers for publicizing Doty's search, then some criticism is due for putting Pood's stuff on this board.

Actually, WtW, I was unaware that I had ever chastised anyone (CoB or otherwise) for discussing Doty's job interview in this forum. Perhaps a few did, but you'd be advised to cite the specific sources -- in theory they're here in this board -- and not make sweeping generalizations. Until such time as your aim resembles Elvis Costello's, I recommend you stick to smaller brushes.

Coast Watcher has really hit the head on the nail here. Read CW's post & note that it isn't definitive but rather suggests that there might be something the USM AAUP leadership should consider.

Ethics is such sticky ooze, worse than metaphysics. I'm so glad I stuck to epistemology.

Date: Oct 6, 2005

Does anyone know when the job search will be decided and the winner announced?

Date: Oct 6, 2005

USM Sympathizer wrote:

Does anyone know when the job search will be decided and the winner announced?

Iheard the decision was to be announced next week (Oct. 10th?).

A number of AAUPers from Ball State have contacted people here (not me, though). AAUP at Ball State is aware of the situation.

Amy Young

Date: Oct 8, 2005

(Is the Ball State provost search in trouble?)

http://www.bsudailynews.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2005/10/07/4346201c7b57d

"E-mail, phone interview address accuracy questions"

October 07, 2005

... [Ball State president:] ...I am keenly interested in moving Ball State forward in pursuit of excellence, innovation, and entrepreneurial thinking. Selecting the right provost is absolutely critical to these endeavors, and I have not ruled out any possibilities — including failing this search — in our quest to secure the academic leadership Ball State needs....

...While I do hope to be able to announce a decision within the next 10 days, it is possible that it could take longer to reach all of the references I wish to contact....

Date: Oct 8, 2005

Jeez...if that had been Shelby who was unknowingly tape recorded by a student prinz reporter.....he would have had apoplexy....and dyspepsia.....and diarrhea.

Date: Oct 10, 2005

Coast Watcher wrote:

so I'm confused wrote:

The confusion pointed at here reflects the ethical paradox that we're in vis a vis our AAUP brothers and sisters at Ball State, who gave Pood the thumbs up as a viable provost candidate. However, as we know, Elliot Pood figured prominently in an incident that could quite conceivably be classified as a violation of one of the AAUP central principles: the defense of academic freedom. Could the leadership of the USM-AAUP chapter report about the status of the Committee A investigation? I can't seem to bring up the AAUP-USM website front page, where the Gulf Coast Incident was prominently headlined for most of this year.
And finally, to cut to the crux of the biscuit, I again ask, "Do we not have an ethical responsibility to inform the Ball State AAUP chapter of what is currently known about the Gulf Coast incident?" Certainly we all want to be shed of the current CoaL dean, but if to do so we have to act unethically--by failing to discharge our professional responsibility to another AAUP chapter--we might be doing considerable harm to the credibility of the USM AAUP, and, by extension, to the cohesion of the entire national organization. This is really something for the leadership to consider, isn't it?

Look, its up to Ball State to conduct due diligence. I'm sure they have, and their AAUP has decided that Pood is the best candidate. Let's just shut up and hope they take him off our hands. Let's face it. EP isn't doing anything we aren't doing. USM is a horrible place to work. I don't blame him for trying to get out. I'm doing the same thing.

Date: Oct 10, 2005

Exactly what I think Qwerty. Though many of us would like for Pood to publically be shown for the incompetent dupe that he is, perhaps we should see that his bid to escape supports our statement that things are HORRIBLE here.

Date: Oct 12, 2005

http://www.bsudailynews.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2005/10/12/434cb5e2eba53

Provost search starts over
President ends search, plans to choose firm to aid in new search

Emily Ortman | News Editor
October 12, 2005

Ball State University’s provost search is starting over after an unsuccessful five-month search.

“After days of research and deliberation, I have concluded that neither finalist for the position is the right fit for Ball State,” President Jo Ann Gora wrote in a President’s Perspective sent out to faculty and staff Tuesday night. “I have therefore made the difficult decision to extend the search, which will continue under the leadership of O’Neal Smitherman.”...

Date: Oct 12, 2005

Well, that stinks. At least we know we can ignore Pood when he says how devoted he is to USM.

Date: Oct 12, 2005

It now appears that Southern Miss has not provided the launching pad to a new career elsewhere for the current deans. The new deans undoubtedly came here with eyes wide open and aware of the manner with which the former deans were relieved of their administrative positions. That knowledge should have given the new ones pause to think. Given the manner with which certain faculty members have been treated at one level or another during the past three years, the new deans undoubtedly have even more pause to think about their own future when the invevitable change in the university's highest level administration finally occurs down the road. Further deterioration of the university's national reputation would very likely make an exit even more difficult. What a dilemma.

Date: Oct 12, 2005

Said the spider to the fly.......

Looks like once you've become one of the SFT gang, you're here for the duration. (That is unless the IHL makes him get rid of you. ) Joe Paul tried to escape with no luck. Only Hudson has gotten away, and many think of him as a spider himself. Many have posted that the USM situation is known all over. It appears to be true.

Date: Oct 12, 2005

Looks like anybody truly wanting out will have to step back to a teaching job elsewhere and start over. That's what EP ought to do. The world won't end if you're not a dean. You might even be happier and less stressed. Life is short. Don't waste it seeking prestige, spend it doing good things.