SFT And His Community - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Apr 28, 2005

SFT And His Community

Date: Apr 28, 2005

Money.

We can have a long thread on how out of control college sports has become and how this is way out of line with funding for education. It is consistent behavior. Shelby cares about money but not about academics and the education his "precious possessions" are getting.

Amy Young

Date: Apr 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Cossack
"I would like to hear from those of you who have more insights into human behavior than I possess. How can you reconcile the concept demonstrated by SFT and his supporters that it is a great thing to hire a coach who is a drunk and a womanizer, and "hire" (recruit) a football player who has been convicted of murder, but Gary and Frank were too dangerous to be teaching students? Is "stupid" the only answer that fits?"

It's interesting that Texas A&M passed on both the coach (even with a lagging b-ball program) and the kid (even though f-ball is primo there), but jumped all over the scholar (Gary). Good choices=good institution.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: answerer
"It's interesting that Texas A&M passed on both the coach (even with a lagging b-ball program) and the kid (even though f-ball is primo there), but jumped all over the scholar (Gary). Good choices=good institution. "

Excellent response; thanks!

Date: Apr 28, 2005

To me it just shows where the priorities of this university are. They'll get rid of good profs, not just Glamser and Stringer, but others as well, but will allow a convicted murder come to the school and play football.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Lord Vader
"To me it just shows where the priorities of this university are. They'll get rid of good profs, not just Glamser and Stringer, but others as well, but will allow a convicted murder come to the school and play football. "

Suggests to me that USM has a very unhealthy organizational culture.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Outside Observer
"Suggests to me that USM has a very unhealthy organizational culture. "

I think this is the biggest understatement in the history of the board.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

Meanwhile, as far as I can tell, both Stringers continue to thrive at A&M--missing their long-time friends and colleagues and worried about USM, but enjoying the vigorous intellectual life there and making new friends.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: foot soldier
" I think this is the biggest understatement in the history of the board."

The Outside Observer tends toward being soft-spoken.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

But SFT said he believes in second changes....
for coaches, football players, VPs of Research,
Provosts, etc. But not even first changes for
faculty and staff. EVEN if Glamser and Stringer
did even the smallest thing that violated
anything, where was their "second" chance?

confused:

Date: Apr 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Pirate
"But SFT said he believes in second changes....
for coaches, football players, VPs of Research,
Provosts, etc. But not even first changes for
faculty and staff. EVEN if Glamser and Stringer
did even the smallest thing that violated
anything, where was their "second" chance?

confused:"

Believe me, they didn't, which is why they didn't resign when Hanberry and Shelboo said resign now and be quiet or we'll fire you. Go back and read the transcript. Everything is there. But you are right. No second chance for them.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

If you really want to know why ST and his followers put athletics first and are destroying the academic programs just do a google search and read about Hitler's Youth Program. There you will find a blueprint for what is happening here.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

I would suggest that anyone on this board who choses to call Marcus Raines a murderer be very careful.

Having practiced law in California for several years, I can tell you this. Marcus Raines has a clean police record. There is no record of any act that you may be alluding to on his record.

In CA, if you or conviced of a crime, any crime, as a minor, the day you turn 18 it is esponged from your record. Also, some of you may want to point to the so called civil trial that Mr. Raines was dragged into. The incident in the civil trial that resulted in a large monetary judgement against Raines was a farce. Because Raines was under 18 when the incident occured, he will not be held legally responsible for payment of said judgement.

Remember how closely everyone here watches EagleTalk to see what is being said. I sincerely hope for some of you that Mr. Raines dosen't have somone watching this board as well.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

Legal Advisor,

How far does all of this go?

Are you saying that it's libelous to declare that Raines pled guilty to manslaughter? To say that he kicked a guy who was down in the head? To note that he spent 3 years in one or another form of detention?

Is any public reference to these matters verboten because they have been expunged from his police record?

We'd all like to know whether you're purveying legal fact or legal FUD.

Robert Campbell

Date: Apr 28, 2005

Legal Advisor must rely heavily on his or her paralegal. Nice subtle correction RC.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

To be honest it would really depend on how far he would want to take the issue. To say that he pled guilty to involuntary manslaughter would probably not raise an issue. To accuse the individual of murder, would certainly give him reason to file a lawsuit. Would he do it? Would he win? Hard to say on either.

But, in MS all it takes to file a lawsuit is $90. It costs a lot more than that to defend oneself against a lawsuit.

Continue as you all wish, but I would encourage everyone to make an effort to keep statements concerning the young man factual.

If you go back and read court documentation, at least one witness testified that Raines didn't kick O'Leary at all. Being a USM alumnus, I became very interested in this case when it broke, and have read as much as I can obtain on the subject.

From what I have read, it is my conclusion that had Raines been in a better socio-economic position that he could have very well fought a 2nd degree murder charge with a great deal of confidence. But, in a situation where you have a dirt poor, black kid, from a bad section of town (Palmdale)...being defended by a public defender, he probably took the best option he had.

I don't know if Bower made the right decision giving this kid a second chance. But, he has a very good record the past 13 years of recruiting kids that are generally good kids. So, I am going to have to give him a wait and see attitude on this one.

I have seen many professors make very disturbing comments towards this young man. I hope that if he ends up in class with you, that you will at least treat this young man decently.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by: Legal Advisor
"I would suggest that anyone on this board who choses to call Marcus Raines a murderer be very careful. Having practiced law in California for several years, I can tell you this. Marcus Raines has a clean police record. There is no record of any act that you may be alluding to on his record. In CA, if you or conviced of a crime, any crime, as a minor, the day you turn 18 it is esponged from your record. Also, some of you may want to point to the so called civil trial that Mr. Raines was dragged into. The incident in the civil trial that resulted in a large monetary judgement against Raines was a farce. Because Raines was under 18 when the incident occured, he will not be held legally responsible for payment of said judgement. Remember how closely everyone here watches EagleTalk to see what is being said. I sincerely hope for some of you that Mr. Raines dosen't have somone watching this board as well."

By the same token you'd think that the lawgroup from Jackson representing THames,littlethames, usm and the IHL would be FAR more careful about what they publicly say. Chaze and his clients are listening;

Date: Apr 28, 2005

Legal Advisor, if you take the posts on this board as your basis for "many professors" making claims, recall that the posts are for the most part anonymous and for the second part not necessarily made by professors. Anyone can post anything here.

However, you are correct that we should all strive for accuracy. How, actually, would one go about suing for libel based on an anonymous post? Could you supeona activeboard or the webmaster or who?? I would like to know -- some very untrue things were said about me. What's the statute of limitations on libel (or would it be slander??)

Actually, if anybody needs to be suing, it's G & S, who have repeatedly been called criminals, as late as last week.

Date: Apr 28, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by: Legal Advisor
"To be honest it would really depend on how far he would want to take the issue. To say that he pled guilty to involuntary manslaughter would probably not raise an issue. To accuse the individual of murder, would certainly give him reason to file a lawsuit."

What do you mean, saying that he pled guilty to involuntary manslaughter would probably not raise an issue? Please explain how the hell it could raise an issue. Is no one allowed to mention the fact that he pled guilty?

As for the head-kicking, didn't other witnesses state that Raines did it?

You'll note that I haven't accused Raines of murder, nor do I intend to do so. I've been sued for libel, by a professor who falsely claimed that his foreign degree was the equivalent of a Ph. D. I've also been dropped from the case before it went to trial.

I'm not even of the opinion that no Division I athletic program should ever sign someone like Raines. But I do think that recruiting someone with his past is a high-risk move... and you have to wonder whether anyone in charge has adequately weighed the risks.

AFAIC, the most important point about the Raines signing, and the Thames regime's subsequent defense of it, is the flagrant hypocrisy of their "second chance" rhetoric. And the repeated gratuitous charges of criminal behavior leveled at Frank Glamser and Gary Stringer are surely as libelous as calling Raines a murderer.

Robert Campbell