I have ABSOLUTELY NO problem if this kid wants to come to USM, pay his way, and play football for us.

But the second my Mississippi tax money goes towards his higher education, I have problems for several reasons, not just his conviction.

1) Raines isn't eligible for federal loans and funding from the US govt. because of his felony conviction. Thus, the entire and total bill of his years at USM are coming from your's (and my) tax funding aimed for higher education in our state. Library books vs. paying for this kid...you decide.

2) Raines isn't even from Mississippi. He is not a product of our public school system. Not to sound xenophobic here, but why should my tax $$ pay for the education of a kid coming from the other side of the country, when I know plenty of disadvantaged kids right here in our state, without felony convictions, who would be jumping at a chance to go to USM but can't afford it. Sure, they may not have made 36's on their ACTs, but they're still bright, and at least average, kids. But too bad for them, we're paying the way for this kid instead.

3) I'm all about tolerance, growth, maturity, change. I do believe in rehabilitation and redemption. But where is Raines going to live, in a university dorm? What about the kids who are going to live on his hall or sit in his classes? I am sure there have been numerous convicted felons in the ranks of students at USM before, but why are we paying for this one to be here? If he wants to come to USM and pay his own way, fine. At UNC-Wilmington last year, a student raped and murdered a freshman girl in their campus dorm bathroom one night. It turns out he was a convicted felon (lied on his application about any prior convictions). The school has since pledged to do a thorough FBI-quality background criminal check on any and every applicant. Convicted felons? Need not apply. I hope USM has good quality insurance; they're going to need it for the big verdict pay-out.....

quote:

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Originally posted by: ram
"This has probably been hashed to death on ET, but I am too lazy to dig through it all.  Just a couple of questions:
(1) Does taxpayer money fund athletic scholarships?  (2) How will other schools in competition for recruits use the presence of Mr. Raines on USM's roster as a tool when talking with the parents of prospects?
 "

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I don't know if taxpayer money is used for athletic scholarships or not - it may be a scholarship that is funded by the Athletic Association or the Alumni Association. If so, I would have LOTS of questions for SFT if I were them.

I tend to agree with some of the other posters here - I don't think that, as a conviceted felon, this kid can qualify for any type of federal scholarship. Can he qualify for state or privately funded one's? Quite probably so, depending upon who is pulling the purse strings for those particular scholarship funds.

Perhaps the real question should be: SHOULD he be able to qualify for state or privately funded scholarships?

Gnome Watcher

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Originally posted by: Gnome Watcher
" ... Perhaps the real question should be: SHOULD he be able to qualify for state or privately funded scholarships? Gnome Watcher"

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You say yes, I say no.
You say stop and I say go go go, oh no.
You say goodbye and I say hello
Hello hello
I don't know why you say goodbye, I say hello

The CL actually did a little googling for their article and found this poignant moment:

Kathleen Harris, O'Leary's mother, brought an urn containing her son's ashes to Los Angeles Superior Court for Raines' sentencing on Jan. 14, 2002, according to the Los Angeles Daily News.

The newspaper said Harris cried when she addressed Raines and said: "This is all I have left of my son. I'm so sick of hearing how you want to play football, Marcus. Well, somebody else's body is not a football. Chris is gone."

quote:

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Originally posted by: Angeline
"The CL actually did a little googling for their article and found this poignant moment:
Kathleen Harris, O'Leary's mother, brought an urn containing her son's ashes to Los Angeles Superior Court for Raines' sentencing on Jan. 14, 2002, according to the Los Angeles Daily News.The newspaper said Harris cried when she addressed Raines and said: "This is all I have left of my son. I'm so sick of hearing how you want to play football, Marcus. Well, somebody else's body is not a football. Chris is gone.""

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As a parent, this just makes me sick. Where is the justice in this???? I'm so sad for my alma mater...what a "wurl'-class" stupid decision on the part of Giannini or whomever made the final call.

4th tier school: where convicted murderers play football.

Truth

If I think about this too much, it just makes me furious. This kid wouldn't be recruited to go to the JUCO he attended if he couldn't play football, nor would he be recruited to go anywhere else. I understand SJ's point above about redemption, but that attitude is what's wrong with society today: nobody can do anything so heinous that it won't be forgiven/forgotten. If you commit a felony act and are convicted, you lose many of your rights as a US citizen (vote, etc.); this is a well-known fact in this country. Perhaps the kid should have given some thought beforehand to what could happen to him when he "piled on" and kicked the guy to death after the guy had been knocked out by someone else. Was this a "heat of passion crime"? No. It was an act of thuggery. I regret that the prosecutor offered a plea agreement and that the Raines kid is even eligible to enroll at USM othern than through our online (correspondence) programs.

First, two disclaimers:  1) I'm not particularly "in" to sports, since I grew up in a family of male athletes in which the women somehow weren't involved.  (The Russian proverb might apply here:  what goes in with the milk goes out with the soul.)  2) I also of course believe in second chances.  Who doesn't, in the abstract?  We've all benefitted from grace being extended to us at different times in our lives.

That being said, however, I am concerned about what we mean by a second chance.  Star athletes are the recipients of massive adulation, a dangerous stimulant.  I don't know the unfortunate young man well enough to know if that adulation is the best thing for his continued attempts to rebuild his life.  Why does a "second chance" need to be as a star?  Is anyone asking this question?

I must also point out the double standard operating here.  This time last year my colleagues Frank and Gary were being put through a living hell by an administration that claimed they "might" have committed criminal offenses.  There was no talk of a "second chance" for them but rather a media ordeal that only ended when the IHL realized that Dr. Thames had no case against them whatever and settled with my colleagues for a significant sum.  Yet even today there's a post on another thread, putatively from EagleTalk, that still claims that Gary and Frank deserved jail time.  Sorry?  If potential criminal offenses mean that someone shouldn't be at USM, then shouldn't a felony conviction be the end of the issue? 

So let me get this straight.  Two senior faculty members with proven track records and impeccable reputations are put through hell and apparently are still being maligned, along with their remaining overworked colleagues on the USM faculty, but it's somehow okay to give a second chance to a person with a felony conviction? 

I cry foul.

Jameela

 

Jameela is wise and thoughtful, as useful.

The bottom line is, football is important. English and sociology aren't--at least not to Thames.

I have always felt that the academy is one of the few places in society where one is allowed to espouse different views, to hold different value systems than the society at large ("Academic freedom"). But under Thames, USM is no longer an academic institution--at least it no longer aspires to be. (I know all of you teaching and researching still are. Academic dissidents working for real education . . . .)

I thought it was unfair for Tim Doherty of the Clarion Ledger to drag Larry Eustachy's name into the mix.

if you read the entire article, you'll see what I mean.

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Originally posted by: Grounded Eagle
"I thought it was unfair for Tim Doherty of the Clarion Ledger to drag Larry Eustachy's name into the mix. if you read the entire article, you'll see what I mean. "

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what is unfair about showing a trend?  first coaches with tainted history and now student athletes

it might be suggested that the "new recruits" eustachy has signed should have a closer review.

There's a huge difference between being an alcoholic and a killer.

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Originally posted by: ram
"No argument there.  But just because we can distinguish one from the other, does not mean that one does not bring the other to mind.  There are differences; can you not see any similarities?  "

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I definitely see your point but, like him or not, I still think iits an unfair comparison. Eustachy committed no crime except for being caught with a can of Nat Light.

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Originally posted by: Outside Observer
"I'm not sure...wasn't he partying  with underage undergraduate students?  Contributing to the delinquency of a minor, etc?"

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Link to Way Cool

From Tigerboard.com
I assume it is from a KSTATE fan to Mizzou fan:


your school, moreso, your athletic department continues to provide a free education to a kid who has been arrested 5 times, once before he even entered school, been charged 4 times, and convicted of crimes 3 times ... yet your football coach still sees fit on paying for a free ride for the convicted thug, abuser and thief.

Which leads many to believe that Mangino still holds out hope that he can somehow sneak John "Five Strikes and your finally out" Randle back into the football program.

Pat Tilman brutally beat a kid when he was 17, he's a national hero today. Marcus Raines made a mistake at a high school party at 17, and likely didn't even inflict the blow that was the cause of death yet still paid a debt to society, cleaned up his act, and still has people chasing him with torches.

Dvorachek (sp) at OU beats a guy into a coma, is still playing football at OU.