Only 1% of MSU's fall 2004 class had an ACT of 15 of less (21 students).

But that empty caboose will be soon be packed with 20,000 students.

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Originally posted by: Insight
"Something just occurred to me. An increase in the number of students to 20,000 means greater revenue for the businesses represented at the Thursday night meeting. You don't have to have an ACT score above 15 to spend money. "

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Excellent point!  I wonder how many of the students who spend their financial aid on cars head on over to Mixon Ford.

Recruitment has circulated a document at various meetings stating that the average ACT for incoming 2004 freshmen was 21.3.  I know because I am looking at it.  Notably, all the data discusses are the growth in the freshmen population with ACTs >21.  While I don't disagree with your numbers, I just need some background as to where you've gotten them.  I do not doubt that mine are propaganda.

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Originally posted by: Incredulous
"It appears that our suspicions about a changing student body have been confirmed according to data in the 2004-2005 USM Fact Book.   The average ACT Composite score for freshmen has dropped from 20.8 to 20.2. That is a substantial drop for only one year.    The number of students with scores of 15 or less has grown from 32 to 60, while the number of scores of 30 or greater has dropped from 52 to 43.   For some reason the boosters left these data out of their full page ad.            

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Do you think this omission of data was deliberate, or only out of ignorance?

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Originally posted by: Parent
"Do you think this omission of data was deliberate, or only out of ignorance?"

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Parent, When somebody spends big bucks on a full page color ad to make the case
that everything is perfectly wonderful at USM, it wouldn't be wise to
point out that the quality of the student body has been going in the
tank for the last three years. Have you seen what has happened to the
national nursing scores (NCLEX)? Those were not featured in the ad either.
 
And, by the way, you should also consider the suggestion made by disgusted student.

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Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"slow night at the cheese household (not really, got plenty to do). i was puzzled by the discrepancy between the mean act score reported in the fact book and that reported by the ihl (20.2 vs. 21.1). what i did was take the table from the 2004-2005 fact book where entering freshmen act scores are tabled. i took the data and my trusty TI calculator and computed the mean myself--double checked my numbers. I came up with a mean of 20.9778, using the composite act score only. my total N was 1443, lower than that in the able. i said, maybe they're using the composite act and converted SAT. using that data (my N = 1493--closer to that in the fact book) i ended up with a mean of 20.73. so, i conclude based on the data in the table that our mean is closer to 20.7 on the low end, or 21 on the high end. "

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Stinky cheese man:

You can slice and carve the data until your fingers are sore. You can use z scores, k constants, and reciprocals. You can use the composite act and the converted SAT. But whatever the statistical manipulation, one fact is clear: The trend has been downward.

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Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"see my comments on the other ACT thread. the trend is not as bad as a 20.2 would suggest. and the trend for UM and USM has been downward. only MSU has been able to keep this trend from occurring (and even there it did one year). "

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It's O.K. to compare USM's trend with UM and MSU. What we need, however, is a comparison of USM with the remaining five public universities in Mississippi. Those five are rapidly becoming our real competitors. UM and MSU are doing their own academic thing. USM seems to be doing the bidding of the IHL and some Hattiesburg businessmen.

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Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"slow night at the cheese household"

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SCM,
 
Administrative Kool-Aid is not good for you or your spouse, so I'm going to make this very easy to understand:
 
In 2000 the university enrolled 40 first time freshmen with an ACT of 16
or lower.
 
In 2003 it was up to 137 students with an ACT of 16 or lower.
 
In 2004 the university enrolled 153 students with an ACT of 16 or lower.
 
Look very carefully at those numbers. That's close to a 300% increase in
low ACT students since Fleming left. I'll go out on a limb and say it
looks like a trend.
 
  

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Originally posted by: Old Prof
"It's tough all around.  The higher ACT students are migrating to LSU, Alabama, Auburn, or Millsaps, Tulane, or Vanderbilit if they can afford the latter set.  Years of budget cuts have taken their toll on even MSU and UM.  A lot of very talented people have left UM and MSU.  USM has just lost faculty and staff at a faster rate.  Students are rather astute about the quality of schools and the faculty losses are having a slow impact on the quality of students. The drain of will only get worse as there is a national bidding war developing for good students among the larger public schools.  This is in recognition that you can't have a Tier II school unless you have something other than a local student body.  There is also an increasing realization that being on the positive end of a brain drain is a good investment for any state.  USM is clearly in the process of being just another undistinguished local degree mill like any of the Cal State schools.  We haven't seen the bottom of the ACT trend yet."

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OP,

Excellent points.

What percentage of USM undergrads are from out of state?

Clemson (a Tier 2 university) was drawing 35% of its undergrads from out of state in the early 1990s.  Fear of punishment by the legislature, followed by a "performance funding" system that would have cut the university's appopriation for drawing too many from out of state, kept the percentage at that level until 1999 rolled around and the Board of Trustees finally realized that the legislature was never going to give us a whole lot more money.  There is a now a push to recruit as many students from out of state as possible.

Robert Campbell

The simple fact is that no state institution in Mississippi is particularly distinguished. They are all second, third, or fourth rate institutions, chronically underfunded and poorly endowed.

The student pool that the state's institutions draw from is only as good as the twelve years of education they recieved prior to college. Since Mississippi sits dead last in every meaningful measure of educational investment and outcome, I'm not surprised that student's test scores are low, no matter which way the trend is going. Add to that the fact that so many of our students come from disadvantaged backgrounds, it is clear we're not the Ivy league; were not even the Atlantic Coast Conference.

Despite the poor preparation of our students, my experience has been that many come to USM wanting to learn and are willing to work hard. Nothing is as gratifying as seeing a student over the course of his or her time here "catch up" and develop a real intellectual facility. That commitment isn't reflected in test scores.

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Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"according to the IHL data book--14.5% of USM students are non-residents; 25.3% of MSU students are non-residents; 33.8% of UM students are non-residents."

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From USNWR (2005 e), out-of-state %s:

MSU 20%, UM nr; USM 9%, Alabama 20%, Auburn 37%, UAB 6%, LSU 10%, Tennessee 14%, Arkansas 12%, Georgia 11%, Georgia Tech 35%......

quote:

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Originally posted by: USNWR
"Clemson 32%"

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The 2005e of USNWR reports 28% for Clemson . . . close enough

Oops.  That's what I get for quoting out-of-state percentages for Clemson from memory

There has been an effort to upgrade requirements for HS graduation in South Carolina (starting around 6 years ago).  There are also state-funded scholarship programs that try to entice more of the highest performing HS grads to stay in state. All of this despite the fact that SC is still at the very bottom on SAT scores (though the interpretation of that number needs to take heed of the fact that every HS student is required to take them here).

Over the past decade, average SAT scores for incoming Clemson students have been going up.  This has more than a little to do with CU's gradual rise in the USN&WR rankings, from around #100 nationally to somewhere in the 70s.  Apparently the corresponding  trend in the Mississippi state system has been stagnant or downward, depending on the institution.

Robert Campbell