USM Plane - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Feb 22, 2005

RE: USM Plane

Date: Feb 22, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Wing Man
"I merely raise due to the comments of one of my confidences in the Board office who has conveyed to me this very issue"

Evidently your source at the Board office does not understand that the faculty here are experiencing a significant amount of stress. Some satire, and other types of humor, is to be expected. That's the way some people deal with these sorts of things.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Wing Man:

This website does not exist to deliver messages to the IHL. We have the faculty leadership represented in various bodies to do that. Although frankly, if the multiple faculty senate resolutions, the faculty senate vote of no confidence, the campus-wide vote of no confidence, the letters from AAUP, from faculty, friends, and alumni don't move them, it is hard to imagine that anonymous postings will. We have our collective and individual influences inside and outside the university. We have the ability to vote, to write letters, to make phone calls, and to speak out in public forums. People can lurk on this website. They can eavesdrop. They can manipulate. They can participate. They can take what they read with a little salt or a lot. They can ignore the website. They can pick up hints and go looking for a some confirmation. You, however, are not in charge of setting the mission for the website. Nor am I. It is what it is and part of what it is is light-hearted entertainment and release from the Thames-induced stress that affects us all.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Frowny face
"Evidently your source at the Board office does not understand that the faculty here are experiencing a significant amount of stress. Some satire, and other types of humor, is to be expected. That's the way some people deal with these sorts of things. "

Wing Man:

I think "Frowny Face" has it exactly right. Finding humor in the most bleak situations, often dark and bizarre humor, is the best non-pharmaceutical stress reliever known to man. Well, maybe the second best. Anyway, none of the irreverent posts that you see here are intended to insult or offend, and they're certainly not intended to undermine the primary mission, ridding USM of Shelby Thames.

I don't know you of course, but suspect you may have some military background, given your screen name. I'll tell you a little of mine. I flew over 300 MEDEVAC missions, usually under heavy fire, over south Viet Nam. I was downed twice, wounded, and I lost many good friends there, innocent young apolitical kids, Navy Medical Corpsmen who were literally slaughtered before my eyes while trying to save others, both Americans and Vietnamese. I don't think I could have made it through each day without being able to express my anger and sorrow, and sadness and fear, through humor, often of the darkest kind. It's hard to explain even now, but I assure you that it works. So give these folks a break. They're doing the very best they can under the most trying of circumstances, and I'm certain they mean no disrespect to you. Humor is good, even when it's bad.

Thanks for listening,

Least Venerable

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Hmmm... The IHL board finds SACS too "technical" so they send their professional staff out to read an internet message board. Makes sense to me.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Invictus
"Hmmm... The IHL board finds SACS too "technical" so they send their professional staff out to read an internet message board. Makes sense to me. "

Invictus may be on to something here. Could it be that somebody in the IHL office does actually monitor this message board? Let's hope so. I just don't want anybody picking and choosing which posts get to IHL. If they read one, they should read them ALL!

Date: Feb 22, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Secret Agent Man
"Invictus may be on to something here. Could it be that somebody in the IHL office does actually monitor this message board? Let's hope so. I just don't want anybody picking and choosing which posts get to IHL. If they read one, they should read them ALL!"

HEY, ROY

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Welcome home, Least Venerable!! Thank you for your service.

Republic of South Vietnam, 1970

Date: Feb 22, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Outside Observer
"Welcome home, Least Venerable!! Thank you for your service. Republic of South Vietnam, 1970"

Thank you Sir, and thank you for your service as well. Perhaps we'll talk more at the big coming out party, which I hope will occur sooner rather than later. I was a Navy chopper pilot with Helicopter Combat Support Squadron 7, operating in support of the III Marine Amphibious Force. Was all over the place, from Da Nang up to and north of the DMZ in 68-69-70, primarily ferrying casualties from fire fights out to the hospital ships Sanctuary and Repose, as well as field hospitals. It was a terrible thing and our finest hour, all rolled into one. Probably the reason I have such contempt for all politicians. You never quite get over it. You know what I mean. With any luck, I'll talk to you later.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

It can't help but change you. Pretty significant year out of one's life.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

or...in your case...3 years!

Date: Feb 22, 2005

I am currently working on the Lit. Analysis paper with my Comp II students. The book we're reading? A Rumor of War by Phillip Caputo. Anyone familiar with this book knows what type of humor (could be perceived "warped" by the uninitiated) exists in this book. Context, please.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Re the somewhat off-topic query on Philip Caputo, A Rumor of War.

I once TA'd in a course that used this book. It's quite good, but "humor" is not a word that occurs to me when I think of it. The text is trenchant, insightful, and deeply serious, but not humorous. Unless, of course, I've forgotten it since the early 90s.

The local Vietnam lit expert is surely Maureen Ryan. I'd have a chat with her.

Cheers,

Jameela

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Jameela, You're right on to the humor. It was warped. It was humor in survival mode. There was no real humor at all, but the seriously sad use of humor underscored how devastating the war actually was to these naive young people who signed up for the sake of nothing better to do or the vision of Camelot and the follow-up to Brokaw's Greatest Generation. THe humor wasn't funny, it was a way to survive. Thus is my point. Some of the humor on this Board is a survival type of humor. Not pointing fingers or making excuses.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

I TOTALLY agree! Great analogy.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Okay, it's been at least 15 years since I read the book, though I still treasure my copy. I don't remember any humor at all, even black, but give me some page numbers and I'll look for the humor. You've read it more recently, so I assume you can be trusted better than my memory.

And yes, "gallows humor" is a well-known phenomenon in literature. I do remember that Caputo quotes a good bit of Shakespeare, but I can't remember if he ever quotes the dying Mercutio from Romeo and Juliet, who says, "Ask for me to=morrow, and ye shall find me a grave man" (3.1).

Jameela

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Will send you the pages of the ironic black humor and phrases. My first year comp students are riveted - they actually get it. You are right, it isn't "humor" - it's survival mode. I'm using the 1996 ed. (the last one since the 1977 ed.). I don't see the category of humor as slapstick. See More's humor keeps me upright, other parodies and observations keep me strong. Since you know the book - I'm eager to bring you back into it - if you want to. I am getting some great writing from my comp students.

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Chapter Eighteen entry

Merry, it was to laugh there -

Where death becomes absurd and life absurder.

For power was on us as we slashed bones bare

Nor to feel sickness or remorse of murder.

Wilfred Owen "Apologia Pro Poemate Moo"

Date: Feb 22, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
"Will send you the pages of the ironic black humor and phrases. My first year comp students are riveted - they actually get it. You are right, it isn't "humor" - it's survival mode. I'm using the 1996 ed. (the last one since the 1977 ed.). I don't see the category of humor as slapstick. See More's humor keeps me upright, other parodies and observations keep me strong. Since you know the book - I'm eager to bring you back into it - if you want to. I am getting some great writing from my comp students."

Great, Educator. I can't promise I've got time to reread the book at the moment, but I'm up to talking about bits of it. This conversation is probably too off-topic for this list, but you can send me the references via my USM mailbox--anonymously--via Truth (who won't divulge your ID) or just to me at the address Truth's got if you trust me.

Everybody else, it occurs to me that this book might be therapeutic if you weren't there and won't have flashbacks. From the amazon.com blurb at <http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/080504695X/qid=1109122752/sr=2-1/ref=pd_ka_b_2_1/104-0051881-6559917>:

"When it first appeared, A Rumor of War brought home to American readers, with terrifying vividness and honesty, the devastating effects of the Vietnam War on the soldiers who fought there. And while it is a memoir of one young man’s experiences and therefore deeply personal, it is also a book that speaks powerfully to today’s students about the larger themes of human conscience, good and evil, and the desperate extremes men are forced to confront in any war."

I.e., it speaks the truth about a situation, something we've all found bracing and essential under this administration.

Jameela

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Correction: or via Truth. I.e., you've got three way to reach me.

Cheers,

Jameela

Date: Feb 22, 2005

Message sent to truth. I'm just excited that I have another scholar interested in it - even by this type of forum. With the situation in Iraq - this book has brought so much home to my students in many ways. Their writing is a reflection of their involvement in this book. I hadn't taught it in almost 15 years, but I'm so glad I decided to use it. Truth will give you my email and I would appreciate any comments you can make on it.

Yes, we've turned this topic way around. If anyone else is reading this - I'd just like to point out that what you perceive as overall humorous overture or response normally has a lot of underlying feelings that serve as the essential subtext for the post (Remember the movie and tv series MASH?). Humor is a device for survival. IHL Board members - surely you get the point. I can only hope that you do.

OKay the USM Plane Topic is no longer under hostage conditions!!

Date: Feb 23, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
"The book we're reading? A Rumor of War by Phillip Caputo. Anyone familiar with this book knows what type of humor (could be perceived "warped" by the uninitiated) exists in this book. Context, please."

OO, I wasn't really in-country for three years, although it seemed like 300 years at the time. I arrived in DaNang on Thanksgiving day of 1968, while the airfield was taking heavy mortar fire. Our pilot said something like "I can't come to a complete stop on the runway, so you boys will have to jump out and run like hell." A boy I was, and run I did. That experience gave new meaning to the term surreal. I finally returned to the states in May, 1970, so "only" 18 calendar months there.

This is an interesting discussion on literature of the era, particularly for those of us who're able to compare literary depictions with the actual experience. While I believe Caputo's "A Rumor of War" does a credible job of capturing the time and is a favorite of academics, a much better treatment, in my opinion, is James Webb's "Fields of Fire." Webb, for me at least, is the Stephen Crane of the Vietnam conflict. For a riveting non-fiction account of the war and it's personal consequences, read Robert Mason's "Chickenhawk." It's extraordinarily well written but a very unsettling story of innocence lost. I can't leave out two seminal works by Tim O'Brien. "The Things They Carried," and "If I Should Die In A Combat Zone." National Book Award notwithstanding, I thought O'Brien's "Going After Cacciato" was vastly overrated. And finally, one should not overlook "In Pharoah's Army," by Tobias Wolff. All right, I know I'm not really a lit guy, so I'll shut up now.

Oh, and one more thing before I go forth in search of morning java, No Quarter!

Date: Feb 23, 2005

Whether 1/3 of this was bought with donor money or 100% was footed by donors, how is USM going to afford fuel, maintenance and storage? Or maybe they will just keep it on the front lawn of the dome? A pilot salary is nothing compared to the upkeep of an airplane.

It is like where I currently work we got grants for a ton of new technology stuff. The problem? We have to pay for the maintenance and we have NO where to put the stuff...sometimes just because something is free...well you get the point

Date: Feb 23, 2005

Tiny's plane