CoB Bombshell!!! - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Feb 5, 2005

RE: RE: RE: CoB Bombshell!!!

Date: Feb 5, 2005

When is the PC meeting??? and where??

Date: Feb 5, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Attention Kmart shoppers
"Isn't Dr. Trellis Green still on the PC? Isn't he part of CoB?"

Yes, A.K.S. Trellis and Tammy Greer usually ask tough questions too. It should be another interesting week.

Date: Feb 5, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"invictus--thanks for the offer but i'm trying to reduce the amount of red meat i'm eating, although i'd like to take a chunk out of someone's back side. (on the other hand, maybe not--gross)."

Then seafood it is!

And fear not, Shelby appears to be biting himself on the a$$ pretty well on his on.

"i've just got this sense that thames has spent all of his political capital with the board and more. i don't think the IHL members want on their resume the loss of USM's accreditation. downsizing or whatever is one thing, the loss of accreditation is another. and i'm sure that this latest move, given what i heard the SACS consultant advised the cabinet on, will seriously jeopardize our accreditation unless they remove Thames. this latest move indicates that he is almost defying SACS and you know how well that goes over with SACS. he could do additional stupid things from now until whenever. "

I hope you're right about IHL, but you know I don't share your optimism about the board as a whole.

Date: Feb 5, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: day/time?
"When is the PC meeting??? and where??"

I believe the PUC meets at 7 a.m. on Wednesday, February 9 in Union Hall of Honors. Since the Union doesn't open until later you may have to enter through the Post Office area.

Date: Feb 5, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Reporter
"I believe the PUC meets at 7 a.m. on Wednesday, February 9 in Union Hall of Honors. Since the Union doesn't open until later you may have to enter through the Post Office area."

Sounds really customer friendly!

Never mind, I forgot we were talking about external forces!

Date: Feb 5, 2005

invictus--seafood it is. yes, i have been more optimistic than you. i've also been around enough to hear your scenario. at times i believe your scenario, at times i don't. i still think (yeah-keep on the sunny side) that this is the last straw for the IHL. Thames is ignoring the advice of the SACS consultant, and i'm sure that will get back to the board. if so, they need to realize (maybe Crofts will illuminate them) the implications of that.

Date: Feb 5, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"Thames is ignoring the advice of the SACS consultant, and i'm sure that will get back to the board. if so, they need to realize (maybe Crofts will illuminate them) the implications of that. "

I hope so. But it is also possible that they are getting "another side of the story" through the back channels that SFT is so adept at utilizing. All it takes is getting the message to the board that SACS isn't really going to pull USM's accreditation or that the sanction really isn't as serious as it sounds. You can bet the farm that Shelby has his buddies working those back channels like crazy right now.

He's having too much fun destroying a large state institution to quit now.

Date: Feb 5, 2005

invictus--i hope they talk to the SACS consultant they're paying $600 per day plus expenses. as you well know, she can't say what SACS will do (because she doesn't know), but she can discuss her perceptions of how well things will work out given events in the CoB. i still hope (and think) some saner heads will say that we can't lose USM's accreditation. that doesn't mean they don't want to demote USM to a lower level university (like Delta State for example). if we lose our accreditation, they couldn't even do that.

Date: Feb 5, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: truth4usm/AH
"

I don't think David is on the PUC anymore, but I believe Anne Wallace is. SOMEONE definitely needs to mention this, though!"

Right, truth, I am no longer on the PC. Trellis Green is indeed still a member and is from CoB. I've tried to reach him today several times but been unsuccessful.

The PC will meet at 7 am on Wednesday, Feb. 9 in Union H. I always had to enter through the kitchen, but I got there around 6:30 a.m. I think if you come close to 7 and enter the union on the side closest to Johnson Science Tower, you should be able to get in. I have to be at my placement by 8 am, so it is unlikely I will get to attend.

I did hear on Friday (before we knew about the CoB debacle) that the FS resolution has been requested to be on the agenda. You can bet your bippy that if I were there it would come up, and I'm pretty confident that Trellis, Tammy, Anne and others won't let it go by either.

Date: Feb 6, 2005

Unbelievable. I sign off for ONE DAY to collect my thoughts, and come back online to this!

Yes, I'm on the PC. And David Johnson is right: 7 am, Union H. Union H is across the hallway from the Hall of Honors. I entered through the door facing Walker, but it was almost 7 when I got there. I'll be there earlier this time . . .

Business colleagues, please come if you can. I'm going to learn all I can about this before I show up, but we'll need you there to help slow the spin. There is, of course, a set agenda which we'll need to get through. But I don't have any other commitments on Wed. morning. I'll stay as long as it takes.

Absolutely NO QUARTER, my friends.
Anne Wallace

Date: Feb 6, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Anne Wallace
"Unbelievable. I sign off for ONE DAY to collect my thoughts, and come back online to this! Yes, I'm on the PC. And David Johnson is right: 7 am, Union H. Union H is across the hallway from the Hall of Honors. I entered through the door facing Walker, but it was almost 7 when I got there. I'll be there earlier this time . . . Business colleagues, please come if you can. I'm going to learn all I can about this before I show up, but we'll need you there to help slow the spin. There is, of course, a set agenda which we'll need to get through. But I don't have any other commitments on Wed. morning. I'll stay as long as it takes. Absolutely NO QUARTER, my friends. Anne Wallace "

Good Morning Anne. I can't remember, do the PC members have a chance to revise and /or approve the agenda at the beginning of the meeting? I'm just wondering if you can get to CoB issues with everything else on the agenda.

Date: Feb 6, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Ray Folse
" Good Morning Anne. I can't remember, do the PC members have a chance to revise and /or approve the agenda at the beginning of the meeting? I'm just wondering if you can get to CoB issues with everything else on the agenda."

Ray,

I don't know how things are working in the PC now, but it was not at all unusual for us to shift agenda items by agreement at the beginning of a meeting. This was most often done at the request of Dr. Thames, but did occasionally happen at the request of Bobby Middlebrooks.

Anne, hang in there, as I know you will. I'm considering whether I can attend Wednesday a.m. and whether that is wise. I have an internship that I have to be at by 8 am, but I may be able to do something about that.

This is a critical issue, as we all know, and really could lead to the complete disintegration of the SACS accreditation process. AACSB is already done as far as I can tell.

I hope lots of folks will try to show up for the PC meeting Wednesday.

DJ

Date: Feb 7, 2005

Doty is ****ed and has responded with a 4-page letter to Grimes. May the fighting begin!

Someone needs to get copies of these letters.

Date: Feb 7, 2005

Well, this could be a real breaking point for the college, university, and Dean Doty's place as Dean. I applaud him for the courage to stand up for standards and preserving the integrity of the college. Although, if he didn't, he would end up being the Dean of the University of Phoenix-Hattiesburg, so what is there to lose? Nothing! Dumb move by the admin in my opinion backing the college into the corner, somone will win or lose this battle/war in a big way. It's wide open now. Maybe Thames read Machiavelli, but not the Art of War by Sun Tzu. Never trap your enemy in a corner where the only recourse is to fight to the bitter end. It's on.

By any chance, do you have any info on the contents of the letter?

Signed,

Former business prof, saddened by the stupidity.

Date: Feb 7, 2005

Stick Me With A Corn COB:
Love your name - Nom committee please take note.

No Quarter!

Date: Feb 7, 2005

Ray and Dave,

Myron has asked for the addition of this issue to the agenda (over both our names)--Dave, I didn't think about asking for this at the beginning of the meeting, but of course you're right. Will do, and hope to see you there (if you can).

NO QUARTER.
Anne Wallace

Date: Feb 7, 2005

I hope a reporter from the HA (and CL, for that matter) will be at the meeting. This COB mess needs WAAAAAAAAY more coverage in the local press than it has received. It also needs national attention, perhaps from the Chronicle. Faculy around the nation should be quite alarmed by what this portends.

Date: Feb 7, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: USM Sympathizer
" Faculy around the nation should be quite alarmed by what this portends."

Particularly the faculty of the sister in-state schools, eh? Does anyone know if the folks at those institutions are up to speed on this?

Date: Feb 7, 2005

Unsmelly paint or not - it smells in other ways.

Date: Feb 7, 2005

Can you imagine what this will do, if true, to recruiting business faculty?!

Date: Feb 7, 2005

Heck, folks governance is a SACS issue. The main focus of all accreditation, even SACS is this: Does your school lie about what it is? Are you a fraud? If you contend that you are what you say you are, can you offer some proofs---assessment plans, your response to data generated in assessment--long range plans and your assessment of your progress on those plans. You cannot create an assessment plan worth a flip in a pansy fishmonger provost's office or a Dunlop tire salesman's office. Honesty means that you create degree programs and assessment plans via expert faculty in the field of inquiry...to do less is to lie. To lie is the big accreditation sin. SACS NEEDS TO SEE EVERYTHING NOW.

Moreover, GOVERNANCE includes our Board...They promise to deliver the people of Mississippi the high standard program in the catalogs and policy manuals...If a small minority on the Board wants to make USM tank, that is SACS business. If they let this nightmare go on, the GOVERNANCE issues may have implications for all eight universities under their care...IHL Board members may not be aware of how this storm may spread...We have to make sure SACS knows all now---that is the only hope for saving the school for the poor people of Mississippi who are being told that if they will tax themselves, their universities will help lift their kids by the boot strap. This now become a fraud on the people of Mississippi. That is a SACS issue for the Board to contemplate. SACS needs some help raising it. That is the real nuclear option--but it is a neutron option--only kills the dome--leaves all else clean to reinvent a decent school again.

Date: Feb 7, 2005

If USM goes belly up, where will my child's academic record/transcript be housed?

Date: Feb 7, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: File 13
"If USM goes belly up, where will my child's academic record/transcript be housed?"

If USM goes belly up, will my academic record/transcript be hosed?

The question you should be asking is not where the records would be kept but what the reputational value of those records would be if USM were to go belly up.

Date: Feb 7, 2005

old curiosity shop,

If the governance issues, in SACS terms, really can be shown to spread to the other 7 schools in the Misssissippi state system, it will bring their presidents in against Thames and his regime.

Up to now, as far as I can tell, the Presidents of Ole Miss and Miss State may have deplored Thames' behavior in private, but they have refrained from criticizing him in public. If they begin see the Board's conduct, in putting Thames in office and keeping him there, as threatening their own institutions, Thames will not be able to withstand their opposition.

Robert Campbell

Date: Jun 2, 2005

kick