Requirements to Teach @ USM - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Jan 13, 2005

Requirements to Teach @ USM

Date: Jan 13, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: job seeker
"
THE UNIVERSITY of Southern Mississippi Gulf Coast is seeking a qualified adjunct faculty member to teach General Chemistry. The successful candidate must have a minimum of 18 graduate hours toward a master's degree in chemistry; an M.S. or Ph.D. is preferred. Qualified applicants should contact Dr. Dale Ledford, Chair, College of Science & Technology at (228) 214-3310 or (228) 355-0859 or 730 E Beach Blvd., Long Beach, MS 39560. AA/EOE/ADAI"

Someone needs to familiarize Dr. Ledford with the SACS requirements for faculty teaching at the undergraduate level. As I've posted here before, the "new" SACS Principles aren't as prescriptive as the older Criteria, but the published guidelines clearly state that "(f)aculty teaching baccalaureate degree courses: a doctoral or a mater's degree in the teaching discipline or a master's degree with a concentration in the teaching discipline (minimum of 18 graduate semester hours in the teaching discipline)."

OTOH, if chemistry at Gulf Park is a 2-year technical degree, a person with a bachelor's degree is OK...

Date: Jan 13, 2005

it's possible that you could use a graduate teaching assistant to teach general chemistry and still be within SACS. they would have to have 18 graduate hours in chemistry, but not necessarily have finished the masters or doctoral degree. the key is--they've have to be a GTA (on a stipend).

Date: Jan 13, 2005

Stinky,

Please clarify for me.

If I had a Master's degree in, let's just say geography, and 18+ graduate hours in Chemistry but was not a GTA, then I would not be considered qualifed to teach basic chemistry at the college level? If I became a student in the IDV program, however, and were awarded a GTA then I would be?

Thanks!

Date: Jan 13, 2005

if you had a masters in one area, but 18 graduate hours in chemistry, you could teach general chemistry. i know people doing that at various junior colleges in the state.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

Class, that's what I thought too but that's not what Stinky Cheese Man said so I am looking for some clarification. Thanks.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

sorry--i called myself class when it was really me.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
" the key is--they've have to be a GTA (on a stipend)."

Then with an out of field master's degree and 18+ hours in the field to be taught one doesn't have to be on a GTA stipend? Sorry if I am being dense. This is the post that I didn't understand.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

Never mind, I got it. No Master's degree in any field is required if one has 18+ hours and is currently prusuing a graduate degree in the teaching field and on a GTA.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

what i'm referring to are graduate students. a graduate student in a program may teach even if they have not completed the degree (even a masters) if they have 18 hours and are on a stipend. they can't be an adjunct (in this case i'm defining an adjunct as a graduate student who is active in a program, has not completed the degree, but is not on assistantship) who is teaching as PTI. some programs didn't have enough money to put masters people on assistantship but would pay them for a course or two, after they had 18 hours. that's a no-no. of course, major institutions like Georgia violate the spirit of this rule a lot.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"it's possible that you could use a graduate teaching assistant to teach general chemistry and still be within SACS. they would have to have 18 graduate hours in chemistry, but not necessarily have finished the masters or doctoral degree. the key is--they've have to be a GTA (on a stipend)."

A graduate assistant can only be used when there is a "real" professor (who does meet the criteria) serving as "instructor of record." Ostensibly, the instructor of record is responsible for approving all tests, lectures, etc., as you well know.

The ad in the Sun Herald was not for a graduate assistant. It was for an adjunct professor. In fact, I didn't know universities routinely advertised that they were hiring graduate assistants...

Date: Jan 13, 2005

graduate students can be used when they are supervised by a faculty member. the faculty member does not have to be the instructor of record. in fact, the concept of "instructor of record" gets nuanced by lots of universities. i know universities who use masters students right out of undergraduate degrees to teach courses--they have full responsibility for the lectures and grading. this isn't USM--at least on the hattiesburg campus, we've met the letter if not the spirit of the rule.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

I forgot to note that a graduate teaching assistant who is working on a doctorate theoretically already holds a master's.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

Something is strange here. The ad says full time, but the description says adjunct. Maybe someone is in line.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

Yes, they'd prefer a person with a Masters or Ph.D.but it is not required to become a full time faculty member (instructor I'd imagine) in chemistry. They are seeking a chemistry instructor and are willing to consider people who have eighteen hours towards a Masters (I would imagine in chemistry or a closely related field).

Date: Jan 13, 2005

Adjunct usually implies part time and temporary.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: What this says
"Yes, they'd prefer a person with a Masters or Ph.D.but it is not required to become a full time faculty member (instructor I'd imagine) in chemistry. They are seeking a chemistry instructor and are willing to consider people who have eighteen hours towards a Masters (I would imagine in chemistry or a closely related field)."

Yes, that is exactly what the ad says. They are not advertising for a graduate teaching assistantship. (Do they advertise such things?) While SCM had a (weak) point about graduate assistants teaching undergrad classes -- and I believe those TAs would be need to be doctoral students & not master's students, that is simply not what is being advertised.

My original point is that a person who does not possess a master's degree in chemistry or a master's degree with 18 graduate hours in chemistry is simply not going to meet SACS credentialling requirements to teach undergraduate classes.

Go ask the deans at any community college if they hire baccalaureate-level personnel with 18 hours toward their masters to teach academic classes.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

invictus and others--sorry if i've confused people. there is no way a university should hire someone with a baccalaureate degree to teach undergraduate classes. it is a blunt SACS violation. however, as i read the ad i didn't see them as suggesting an undergraduate degree would be sufficient. it asked for an ms or phd, and 18 graduate hours in chemistry. this is a standard description for many junior colleges. the reason i suggested that a graduate student could work is that you could have a finishing chemistry doctoral student, pre- or post-comps, looking to make some extra money, teaching a general chemistry class. clearly meets SACS. or you could have someone with a completed masters in chemistry teach. clearly meets SACS. the issue on GTA's versus adjuncts happens at the masters level.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

invictus--i'm not sure what about my point on masters students teaching undergraduates is weak. it happens all the time--at USM after they have 18 graduate hours, are of good status in their program, and are on assistantship (meaning faculty supervision).

my example of a student teaching at Georgia as a new masters student (no graduate hours) is accurate--not necessarily good (i don't think it was good)--but it happens at Georgia and others SACS accredited universities (particularly those tier 1 and 2 universities). i taught as a newly minted masters student when i was working on my graduate degrees at a non-SACS university. still happens there.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
" however, as i read the ad i didn't see them as suggesting an undergraduate degree would be sufficient. it asked for an ms or phd, and 18 graduate hours in chemistry. "

The ad said the MS or Ph.D. was preferred. That implies you could be hired without a graduate degree if you had the 18 graduate hours.

Date: Jan 13, 2005

SCM - no apologies necessary. I'm just reading the following from the ad literally:

"The successful candidate must have a minimum of 18 graduate hours toward a master's degree in chemistry; an M.S. or Ph.D. is preferred."

This says simply that the person must have 18 hours toward a master's degree & that the master's itself is preferred. It does not state that a master's (in any discipline) is required. So as it stands, the ad is saying that a person with a bachelor's degree & 18 graduate hours toward a chemistry master's is qualified.

Moreover, "18 graduate hours toward a master's degree in chemistry" is not quite right. It has to be 18 graduate hours in chemistry. I'm working under the assumption that most master's students take courses outside their major & the ad doesn't make it clear that only chemistry hours count toward the "magic 18".

I think what the ad is intended to say (a master's with 18 hours in chemistry is mandatory & an M.S. in chemistry is preferred) & what it actually says are two different things.

Does nobody review these ads before they're published?

Date: Jan 13, 2005

folks--i'm beaten into submission. frankly, i suspect the ad copy wasn't proofed carefully. no surprise.

Date: Jan 14, 2005

Unless . . . . GASP . . . . they already have someone in mind who meets the criteria of only having 18 hours towards a Masters in Chemistry, and that's who they want to hire. Or, of course, it could be sloppy advertising - this would not surprise me either.

Date: Jan 14, 2005

I should have said criterion since I guess this 18 hour thing is the only requirement (unless having a pulse also counts).