I Heart Certain Depts. and Colleges - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Nov 20, 2004

RE: I Heart Certain Depts. and Colleges

Date: Nov 20, 2004

If the Unit was so prepped, a delay instituted by CM would not have been necessary, no matter what the circumstances. No SPA reports/program reviews would have been problemmatic. A revised conceptual framework would have been completed and implemented by 2000-2001.

What year did Martray ask for the delay? Key members of the team were gone - or about to bolt - when he asked for the delay. People who had taken over some of these pivotal positions were out of their league. Perrin Lowery as NCATE coordinator? Come on. Perrin was a great administrator in the Hburg schools as well as an adjunct for USM, but then he comes in promoted to Assoc. Prof. and is given the responsibility of running something that he has no background in? That was actually quite unfair. Let's see who's gone -- Howell, Siders, Sirochman, the Martins, Malone, Slick, Whiting, Richards, Maztdel, Klotz, Marchek, Sulentic, Cicarelli, Scott, Miller I'm leaving people out but I think my point is made. Martray asked for a delay when he knew that HE was out as well.

Date: Nov 20, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by: Bad, but not quite that bad
" Yes, the neglect goes way back--to immediately after the 1998 report. The whole unit (which includes four colleges and over 40 licensure/prof ed programs), just seemed to tread water for years, and did not keep up with the sea change that has been going on in educational outcomes assessment and programs.

1999-2003

Capacity Building

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/info/index.html

Implementation

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/info/00-03/objectives.html

A Culture of Collaboration and Support for Professional Development

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/info/00-03/cti/index.html

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/resources/travel.html

Continuous, Ongoing and Participatory Program Enhancement and Improvement

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/info/00-03/ptm/index.html

Perfomance Assessment

http://www.usm.edu/btle/index.html

Field-Based Partnerships and Products

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/info/00-03/tech_mentor/participants.html

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/info/00-03/tech_mentor/lp.html

Continuous and Ongoing Standards Based Program Development, Assessment and Accountability

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/info/00-03/gpra_indicators_.doc

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/eval/review/index.html

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/eval/review/schedule.htm

Data Driven Decision Making

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/eval/report_PRS.html

Documentation: Reflective Practice

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/info/99-00/vtc/index.html

Documentation: Project Summaries

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/eval/report_1.html

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/eval/report_2.html

Documentation: External Evaluators’ Summary Report

http://www.usm.edu/pt3/eval/ce.html

WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN?

Date: Nov 20, 2004

Under a Rock, thank you for your post. Check the Creme de la Creme Topic.

Date: Nov 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: New Adjunct
"Now I remember why I changed my major from secondary ed to a liberal art. With due respect for the fine and dedicated people who train our teachers, professional "education" is mind-numbing in its complexity, without, as far as I can see, producing much in the way of a better-educated child. What is all this FOR? BTW the change from BS Ed to BA cost at least an extra year, including more math, a foreign language and some other stuff, but I counted it well-spent! Sorry, I know I'll get flamed, but . . ."

Others may flame you, but you make a good point. I was flamed for making some observations about the state of NCATE at USM. Many people in Jackson and Washington are asking a lot of the same questions as you. Under a Rock posted a slew of links for the university PT3 efforts (which was a great coup) to indicate that NCATE was on target until 2003. However, this is just one component of NCATE, and the links supplied do not speak to some fundamental issues that need to be addressed that have been around for awhile now. I understand the angst of the poster who notes that quite a few good people are gone, and the fact that PL was given a task for which he was unprepared, but what is very important to understand is that NCATE is tied into licensure in Mississippi, and that any potential loss of accreditation at any institution should not be viewed as a cavalier payback for dumb moves by the powers that be (my dear Captain Hook). Although many good people have left, died, or retired, there are many equally good people still working here who do not deserve the ill will of AAUP posters.

Education colleges and programs face significant challenges. The "alternative route" mandate is bearing down quickly, and the traditional college of education structure is in many ways a dinosaur. Grow your own movements are developing, and the community colleges appear set to get into the game of teacher ed (ugh). The good stuff done in prof ed here (like the PT3) does not mean that COEP and prof ed kept up with NCATE tasks at the pace that was needed. Miss State had similar problems, but survived their NCATE process.

One delightful flamer suggested that my observations about the state of NCATE here are self-serving. Actually, whether or not USM does well with NCATE will have little effect on me. I am not in prof ed, and I will likely leave USM sometime in the relatively near future. I do care about my colleagues in prof ed across the university (though there are admittedly a couple left that I wouldn't mind seeing go on to greener pastures). I think, however, that these folks will get through the NCATE process, albeit a bit bruised and battered.

Date: Nov 20, 2004

Bad, I wouldn't flame New Adjunct either. I once suggested that the NCATE criteria are not rigorous and I got flamed myself for saying that. I remember when Bobby Anderson was dean. I perceived his personal and professional standards to be very high. I felt the same way about Carl Martray. The jury is still out on Willie, of course, because he is so new to that particular office.

Date: Nov 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Bad to the Bone
"Bad, I wouldn't flame New Adjunct either. I once suggested that the NCATE criteria are not rigorous and I got flamed myself for saying that. I remember when Bobby Anderson was dean. I perceived his personal and professional standards to be very high. I felt the same way about Carl Martray. The jury is still out on Willie, of course, because he is so new to that particular office. "

Wow. You got flamed for that? NCATE standards aren't that rigorous. They are pretty reasonable. Perhaps the toughest part about NCATE is getting the cats and dogs to play nice so the unit speaks with one voice. Carl was outstanding at that task. If Carl stayed (which wasn't going to happen), I am sure that he would have herded the cats and dogs, and that prof ed would have made it through (though there would have been a lot of scrambling for a couple of years). Carl is a stand up guy (didn't deserve the usual administartor's headaches-depositions and such). Willie has some big shoes to fill. Time will tell.

Date: Nov 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: New Adjunct
"Now I remember why I changed my major from secondary ed to a liberal art. With due respect for the fine and dedicated people who train our teachers, professional "education" is mind-numbing in its complexity, without, as far as I can see, producing much in the way of a better-educated child. What is all this FOR? BTW the change from BS Ed to BA cost at least an extra year, including more math, a foreign language and some other stuff, but I counted it well-spent! Sorry, I know I'll get flamed, but . . ."

Has New Adjunct been flamed in this thread yet?

Date: Nov 20, 2004

No, do you wish to start?

Date: Nov 21, 2004

I am a former USM prof now at a univ.(a few tiers up from USM) where we will have our NCATE visit in the Spring. Everyone is on the same page. All colleges are working together on this. What has been prepared here is a sight to behold. Reminds me of my days in the late 90's and the early 00's when I worked with a remarkable group of people in the professional ed unit at USM. Keep in mind that USM asked for an extension which is a big red flag in the eyes of NCATE - we've been told this at NCATE meetings in D.C. so the extension at USM does not bode well for them. I truly hope that USM weathers this through and passes but I'm with a few other posters - some attitudes have got to change and there's a Prima Dana that needs to allow everyone to work together and turn all of her attention towards becoming a chair in CISE who practices due process for all faculty members and cuts the arbitrary and capricious actions of a few (including herself).

Date: Nov 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Tieranny
" Prima Dana "

Miss I, Mal & Vic...are you reading?

Date: Nov 21, 2004

How dare anyone criticize My Royal Highness (MRH)? I am fair to all of MY people, yet fairer to some who deserve to be treated more fairly because they do as they are told. They realize how sensible I am and understand that I am special. I will treat MY people accordingly. Disagree with MRH and HRH (daddy) and you will be flamed!!!

Date: Nov 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Prima Dana
""

I missed that but you're sharp - good luck!

Date: Nov 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Nd'A Committee Wannabe
"Miss I, Mal & Vic...are you reading?"

Duly noted. However, this entry appeared after the emergency ad hoc committee had adjourned & may appear next week. It will depend on whether the committee scribe, Miss I, feels like phoning us all & changing the write-up. Either way, "Prima Dana" will get consideration.

Wasn't Dana the dog in Peter Pan?

Date: Nov 21, 2004

That would be Nana. Nana was the Darling's family dog.

Date: Nov 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Invictus
" Duly noted. However, this entry appeared after the emergency ad hoc committee had adjourned & may appear next week. It will depend on whether the committee scribe, Miss I, feels like phoning us all & changing the write-up. Either way, "Prima Dana" will get consideration."

Vic,

Miss I called me just before services started and said she couldn't speak long but to "stop the presses" - maybe she has a surprise in mind?

Mal

Date: Nov 21, 2004

The ball is up and in the air

Date: Nov 21, 2004

How did Beth Richmond get promoted to Assoc. Professor when she was an Assistant Prof. as the Barksdale Scholar at USM for the past few years. She did not go under formal review to become an Assoc. Prof. So how did this happen?? Faculty Senate??? Also, the Barksdale Scholar is supposed to be a nationally reknowned academic who has made a "name" in their area. All I can tell is that Beth Richmond made a name for herself by being a student of Mark Richmond'swhen she was in grad school studying with the great Farce of a former Prof. He got divorced and they got married. And, this makes her infamous??????

Date: Nov 21, 2004

Mark Richmond was a joke, and his wife is also one. Sorry, Beth - but your promotion to Assoc. Prof. impresses no one.

Date: Nov 21, 2004

Posters on this board generally have the well being of the university in mind, and we are generally working toward the same goal. The personal attacks in this thread do little to help us reach our true goal.

Date: Nov 22, 2004

Anonymouse makes a good point. Attacking the system is okay, but not individuals. Some of them had no hand in creating the mess it's in now.

Date: Nov 22, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Anonymouse
"Posters on this board generally have the well being of the university in mind, and we are generally working toward the same goal. The personal attacks in this thread do little to help us reach our true goal.
"

I agree. But it is true that Beth Richmond sat with the Thames family at the hearing last spring.

Date: Nov 22, 2004

Beth's husband stabbed two of my colleagues directly in the back with the intent to ruin their careers. This is fairly well known. Are there ways for someone to be promoted without the proper procedures? Doesn't this interfere with due process.

Date: Nov 22, 2004

It's a dept. that has lost its moral compass.