HA Letter - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Sep 20, 2004

HA Letter

Date: Sep 20, 2004

Give 'em hell, Steve Zary!

IIRC, Zary has had some connection to USM athletics (volleyball, perhaps?) in the past, so it isn't exactly a case of "anti-athletics" here. And he has been around USM for a long time. He knows what he's talking about.

Date: Sep 20, 2004

Students do pay for athletic tickets because they pay a fee in addition to their tuition. I don't know what it is called but it enables them to get free tickets to football games. They also pay an arts fee, and I have no idea where that money goes. I've been told that Dean Pood has sole control of it.

Date: Sep 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Music Patron
"Students do pay for athletic tickets because they pay a fee in addition to their tuition. I don't know what it is called but it enables them to get free tickets to football games. They also pay an arts fee, and I have no idea where that money goes. I've been told that Dean Pood has sole control of it."

At least some of the money goes for various events in my area: we have used it to bring in a guest director last year (Paul Weidner to direct Medea); some money helps support Southern Arena Theatre and some money will enable us to make tickets to Much Ado About Nothing available to students for only $2.00 instead of the standard 8.00. I know Music gets some and also dance for guest artists. Don't know about Art. It is pretty important to us -- particularly in funding special events, guest artists, etc. that otherwise we would not be able to have.

Date: Sep 21, 2004

An old link about activity fees & band uniforms from October 2003.

Here's the salient quote:

"The purchase of these uniforms would not be possible without the support of Dr. Shelby Thames," said Dr. Thomas Fraschillo, director of bands at Southern Miss. "President Thames allocated $15 of every student's activity fee to the arts, the majority being used on the purchase of new uniforms this year."

He also noted that 50 cents of every football ticket sold goes directly to the band program for the support of scholarships and equipment. "Our president has made a bold financial gesture to support our arts programs - particularly our marching band this year," Fraschillo said. "The Pride belongs to the university, and being highly visible, we need to reflect the university well."

The article also notes that Dr. & Mrs. Thames "adopted" the first two band uniforms in the fund-raiser described by the article.

BTW, I'm having a devil of a time finding a detailed listing of fees on the USM website. I assume it's buried in the catalog. Heck, I had to Google to find the tuition rate...

Date: Sep 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Invictus
"BTW, I'm having a devil of a time finding a detailed listing of fees on the USM website. I assume it's buried in the catalog. Heck, I had to Google to find the tuition rate..."

You can't find it. At least while I was at USM it did not exist. Even VP's didn't know exactly how the student fees were broken down. Remember, the athletic fees bring in money for non-revenue producing sports. According to the athletic budget, only football, men's and women's basketball, and baseball generate revenues (little over 5 million)

http://www.usm.edu/budgets/budgets/Athletics_Budget05.xls

Student fees make up 3.75 million of the budget, which is good for soccer, softball, track, tennis, golf, etc. Now, my question is, how do you get 3.75 million from students? In the HA opinion it was stated that the fee was $90. Now assuming USM has 16000 students and that they are all full time, then I get 1.44 million. There was also an $800,000 increase in student fees from last year but I don’t remember our enrolment jumping that much.

Date: Sep 21, 2004

It's $90 per semester, so multiply by 2.5 ?? (Does the fee apply to summer school, what is summer enrollment...)

Date: Sep 21, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by: Invictus
"The purchase of these uniforms would not be possible without the support of Dr. Shelby Thames," said Dr. Thomas Fraschillo, director of bands at Southern Miss."

To give the president of a university the credit for providing uniforms for members of its marching band is as absurd as giving the president of the united states the credit for purchasing uniforms for members of the military service. Uniforms are essential for both groups and must be provided to the participants regardless of who the respective presidents might be at the moment. One could just as easily say that "The purchase of these tires for the vehicles in our motor pool would not be possible without the support of our university president." If a university wants a marching band it must provide the support. If a university wants its motor pool vechicles to be equipped with tires, it must provide those tires.

Date: Sep 21, 2004

Do "fees" include licensing fees for logo merchandise? That generates some income.

Date: Sep 21, 2004

The fees under discussion are ones that each student pays when he/she enrolls. They are in addition to tuition (and room, board, and books where applicable) and are collected from every student. My understanding is that some are prorated according to the number of semester hours enrolled, but I'm not sure about that. The licensing fees are not connected to these but are attached to the use of or sale of good using USM logo, seal, etc. --and of course, the controversial eagle.

Date: Sep 21, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by: Invictus
"An old link about activity fees & band uniforms from October 2003.

Statement from the above link: Thanks to the success of the "Adopt-a-Uniform" campaign, the director of The Pride, Dr. Gary Adam, hopes to be able to outfit an even larger band in the future.

Is there a similar "Adopt-a-Uniform" campaign for football uniforms? Most certainly not. Football necessities are furnished to the players without blinking an eye. The same should be true for the band. They should not have to beg, scrape, and borrow. Is the football team required to keep their same jerseys for 12 years? Most certainly not. The band should not be required to do so either.

Date: Sep 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Long Cool Woman in Black Dress
"Is there a similar "Adopt-a-Uniform" campaign for football uniforms? Most certainly not. Football necessities are furnished to the players without blinking an eye. The same should be true for the band. They should not have to beg, scrape, and borrow. Is the football team required to keep their same jerseys for 12 years? Most certainly not. The band should not be required to do so either."

As much as I wish I could agree, the distinction is that 30,000 folks -- well, 18,000 -- are willing to buy tickets to watch the football team. ESPN pays to televise the football team. The same can't be said about the band.

Date: Sep 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: ram
"As much as I wish I could agree, the distinction is that 30,000 folks -- well, 18,000 -- are willing to buy tickets to watch the football team. ESPN pays to televise the football team. The same can't be said about the band."

I understand your point. On the other hand, I'm sure the school of music would greatly prefer to focus its meager resources on more artistic pursuits than a football band; however, that is simply not an option. If the university requires that a football band be provided at every home game, then the university needs to pay for it.

Date: Sep 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: ram
"As much as I wish I could agree, the distinction is that 30,000 folks -- well, 18,000 -- are willing to buy tickets to watch the football team. ESPN pays to televise the football team. The same can't be said about the band."

While the football team is the big draw, don't underestimate the number of parents who show up to see their sons and daughters march with the Pride. I know my parents came to see the band, not the football.

Date: Sep 22, 2004

If the university does not want to fully suppor its band, let the university hire its own marching band (I use 'marching band' here to distinguish it from 'concert band.'). A university band should not have to sell spaghetti suppers to support itself anymore than a football team must sell Bear Bryant cookies door-to-door. The band provides the lion's share of the halftime activities, and universities send their marching band to out-of-state football games. I agree that the departmental authorities would probably prefer that their meager resources go to support other artistic endeavors. Nonetheless, more people see the marching band at football games than see the plays, art exhibits, and other cultural events on university campuses. As I said, if the university wants a band let them support the band. I will even go a step further: If the university wants a marching band, let them pay for it.

Date: Sep 22, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: ram
"As much as I wish I could agree, the distinction is that 30,000 folks -- well, 18,000 -- are willing to buy tickets to watch the football team. ESPN pays to televise the football team. The same can't be said about the band."

It will be a wonderful day when the band has all the money it needs and the football team has to hold a bake sale to pay for uniforms.

Date: Sep 22, 2004

For some reason, the image of a University of Chicago homecoming football game comes to mind. That's right -- a University of Chicago homecoming football game. As described to me, it involves a flag football game with a halftime show delivered by a group of students playing kazoos & marching in precision formation.

[For Truth4USM & others ignorant of the joke here: The University of Chicago quit playing intercollegiate ball shortly after the Manhattan Project took over the stadium. Of course, their last coach was Amos Alonzo Stagg.]

A number of years ago, I attended a USM-Tulane game at the Superdome. The Tulane band wore university sweatshirts & slacks. Total cost of the uniform was probably under $50 & I assumed the students purchased them for themselves.

Date: Sep 22, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Invictus
"... [For Truth4USM & others ignorant of the joke here: The University of Chicago quit playing intercollegiate ball shortly after the Manhattan Project took over the stadium. Of course, their last coach was Amos Alonzo Stagg.] A number of years ago, I attended a USM-Tulane game at the Superdome. The Tulane band wore university sweatshirts & slacks. Total cost of the uniform was probably under $50 & I assumed the students purchased them for themselves."

Vic, thanks for the info (I'm perenially clueless about collegiate athletics). As much as I love marching bands (the only thing worth paying attention to at football games, IMHO), those fancy uniforms may need to go the way of Nugget, the dead golden eagle. If they are too expensive to buy and maintain, then a cheaper alternative might be the way to go.

Date: Sep 22, 2004

Way to go, Steve!

And how much of the library/technology fee the students pay goes to the library? The last time I heard, the library got ZERO.

Date: Sep 22, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: truth4usm/AH
"Vic, thanks for the info (I'm perenially clueless about collegiate athletics). As much as I love marching bands (the only thing worth paying attention to at football games, IMHO), those fancy uniforms may need to go the way of Nugget, the dead golden eagle. If they are too expensive to buy and maintain, then a cheaper alternative might be the way to go."

Personally, I like the idea of the kazoos. Think of the cost savings on instruments!

Date: Sep 22, 2004

Right on Black Dress and Tinctoris......If the university needs/wants a marching band for football and a pep band for basketball, it needs to find a way to pay for these "support" units. A university can certainly have a tier one school of music without much of a marching band--witness Rice University for one. Scrimping and begging for resources to serve athletics is what creates sycophants who will do anything to keep the resources flowing to their programs.

Date: Sep 22, 2004

Haven't you ever heard of the Rice Marching Owl Band, otherwise known as The Mob?

Date: Sep 22, 2004

Yep, Advocate. Sure have. And that's exactly what I mean. The Shepherd School of Music is first-rate, and everyone knows the quality of Rice. I wish USM were willing to have a MEB (marching eagle band) of brainy kids out having fun on Saturday rather than insisting on a band full of music majors on scholarship with $250 apiece wool uniforms.

Date: Sep 22, 2004

Well, at least the kilted bagpipe band from the McCain era has gone the way of Nugget... (Bagpipes are pretty close to kazoos, aren't they?)

One of these wouldn't be bad, if they could mark in nifty formations...