HA article about English/Polk - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Sep 9, 2004

HA article about English/Polk

Date: Sep 9, 2004

http://www.hattiesburgamerican.com/news/stories/20040909/southernmissnews/1206214.html

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: palindrome
"...Polk confirmed he received a letter dated Sept. 2 from Elliott Pood, dean of the College of Arts and Letters, notifying him that Pood was recommending Polk's termination because he did not meet fall classes and had not signed his contract. Polk said he kept former department chair Angela Ball informed during the summer of his plans and told her three weeks before classes began that he would not be returning for the fall semester. He did not submit his resignation until Aug. 31 in order to maintain health insurance coverage, he said. "It's a tempest in a teapot," he said about the letter. "

What a piece of work that Pood is! He fails to respond in any form while USM Police are locking up the offices of Stringer and Glamser, but he's right on the ball writing that termination letter (albeit 2 days after the fact of Noel's resignation).

<SARCASM> Sounds like perfectly great Provost material to me! </SARCASM>

Date: Sep 9, 2004

Thanks for sharing this, although the news continues to be very sad for USM. I just sent the story off to several editors at The Chronicle of Higher Education; I hope they will see fit to call further international attention to the sorry spectacle that Shelby Thames is making of a university I once respected very much.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

By the way, one of the nice ironies of this whole situation is that Noel Polk will now be teaching at Roy Klumb's favorite school!

Date: Sep 9, 2004

I may get flamed for saying this but I think Dr. Pood did the faculty a favor by writing the letter he did to Professor Polk after NP's resignation of August 31. Before you respond, please re-read my old posts on the "A Man's Moral Conscience Thread" now on page 5. From a legal perspective, I don't know how well thought out the actions were on either or both sides. I do believe that Dr. Pood's letter will have the effect of strengthening the implied contract between the university and tenured faculty in the future.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: USM Sympathizer
"By the way, one of the nice ironies of this whole situation is that Noel Polk will now be teaching at Roy Klumb's favorite school! "

Let's hope Ole Roy doesn't confuse Professor Polk with somebody at the Mississippi State athletic department. How ironic that would be.l

Date: Sep 9, 2004

Pood's letter to Noel Polk, as reported in today's Hattiesburg American, could easily be a final blow that puts an end to USM's aspiration for respectable national peer ratings in the foreseeable future. How unfair.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: palindrome
"Here's some relevent portions from the HA's version of events in English: http://www.hattiesburgamerican.com/news/stories/20040909/southernmissnews/1206214.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Faculty who left the English department include: # Poet D.C. Berry, professor, who retired four years early. # Tamara Harvey, assistant professor, who went to George Mason University in Virginia # Susan Malone, associate professor, who moved to Mercer University in Georgia # Noel Polk, professor and William Faulkner scholar, who starts a new job Sept. 16 at Mississippi State University # Mary Robison, professor, who went to the University of Florida # Gary Stringer, professor and noted John Donne researcher, who went to Texas A&M University after President Shelby Thames attempted to fire him. The attempt to fire Stringer and sociology professor Frank Glamser, who spearheaded an investigation of the academic credentials of Angie Dvorak, then-vice president for research and economic development, played a major role in Polk's decision to leave, he said. "These two distinguished professors were close friends," Polk said. "The university's attempts to fire them just underscored how little the administration valued its senior professors." Polk confirmed he received a letter dated Sept. 2 from Elliott Pood, dean of the College of Arts and Letters, notifying him that Pood was recommending Polk's termination because he did not meet fall classes and had not signed his contract. Polk said he kept former department chair Angela Ball informed during the summer of his plans and told her three weeks before classes began that he would not be returning for the fall semester. He did not submit his resignation until Aug. 31 in order to maintain health insurance coverage, he said. "It's a tempest in a teapot," he said about the letter. Polk, who has taught at Southern Miss for 27 years, will teach at MSU and edit the Mississippi Quarterly, which he described as a premiere journal of Southern culture. "If the Mississippi State job had not come through, I would have retired, I think," he said. "I certainly wish my colleagues remaining at USM the absolute best in their continuing efforts to educate my fellow Mississippians. "

USM, as an institution of higher education, is in some very serious difficulties. The manner with which this matter was handled exacerbates the problem even more:

1. A termination letter should come from the chair - not from the dean. Was the chair notified, consulted, or informed as to what was happening? If a contract is not returned, for whatever reason, a dean would normally ask the chair to look into the matter.

2. Just what triggers a termination letter? If a faculty member, for whatever reason, fails to return their signed contract by the deadline, do they get fired two days later? What about previous USM faculty members who retuned their contracts after the deadline - were those faculty members terminated also; or does the rule apply only to Noel Polk?

3. We are talking about a tenured faculty member with 27 years of service to USM. Does tenure really exist at USM?

4. Does USM still have a system of department chairs within its organizational scheme? If so, do they have any role whatsoever in personnel matters such as this?

Date: Sep 9, 2004

in this case it may have been that english didn't have a chair at the time. given that, i assume you go to the next level in the system--the dean.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"in this case it may have been that english didn't have a chair at the time. given that, i assume you go to the next level in the system--the dean."

more excuses, more enabling.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"in this case it may have been that english didn't have a chair at the time. given that, i assume you go to the next level in the system--the dean."

You're right, SCM, that's the way it would normally happen. But we all know that USM isn't operating under "normal" circumstances right now. Shelboo and Pood have both been gunning for Polk since the beginning...since even before the Stringer/Glamser fiasco, if truth be told.

Shelboo has no clue, I repeat NO CLUE, as to how to effectively run an institution of higher learning (other than to run it into the ground for his own personal gain). The UN&WR tier drop is a perfectly great example: create a fix for something that was broken due to your own neglect and short-sightedness ONLY after you are publicly humiliated by the mess your own decision caused. He's putting out fires of his own making left and right, without any clue as to the cost of his lack of leadership. What a terrible, terrible waste...I expect that things truly will get worse before they get any better for USM.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

Wouldn't you have thought Pood would have shown a 27 year faculty member with an international reputation the courtesy of a phone call before he fired off that letter?

One more example of the total lack of regard for the faculty that these folks have--or the total lack of manners!

As truthforUSM said, Pood has been gunning for Polk for a long time. He must have been delighted to have the chance to write the letter. Wonder what he did when he found out he was two days too late!

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: stinky cheese man
"in this case it may have been that english didn't have a chair at the time. given that, i assume you go to the next level in the system--the dean."

Stinky Cheese Man,

Let's assume you are right and there was no department chair in english at that particular time. Would a dean's first action be (a) fire the faculty member two days after the contract deadline, or (b) contact the faculty member and inquire about the matter?

Isn't the dean's academic area of specialization that of communication?

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: palindrome
"Here's some relevent portions from the HA's version of events in English: http://www.hattiesburgamerican.com/news/stories/20040909/southernmissnews/1206214.html Polk, who has taught at Southern Miss for 27 years, will teach at MSU and edit the Mississippi Quarterly, which he described as a premiere journal of Southern culture.

Unless things have changed since I last checked, Mississippi State doesn't offer a doctorate in English. Does anyone know if this has changed, or if they plan to develop a Ph.D. program in English? Isn't their English department faculty considerably smaller (and arguably less distinguished) than that at USM?

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by: Polk Acolyte

"Mississippi State Does their English department faculty considerably smaller (and arguably less distinguished) than that at USM?"

It appearsto me that if USM's English department continues lose significant faculty at the rate is has this year it will be undistinguished. It will, however, probably be large (I understand the liberal arts dean told the new chair the losses would be replaced). But will those "replacements" consist of visible scholars?

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Polk Acolyte
"Unless things have changed since I last checked, Mississippi State doesn't offer a doctorate in English. Does anyone know if this has changed, or if they plan to develop a Ph.D. program in English? Isn't their English department faculty considerably smaller (and arguably less distinguished) than that at USM?"

I looked for a link to the MSU English Dept., but couldn't find it (it appears to be broken). But it does look like that they don't offer a PhD in English there, from what I can tell.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Polk Acolyte
" Isn't their English department faculty considerably smaller (and arguably less distinguished) than that at USM?"

Not any more!!!!!!!!!!!!

Date: Sep 9, 2004

The sad thing is that there still are associate and assistant professors in the English department (Weinauer, Barron, Wallace, Kuskin, Villaponteax sp?) that have the potential to become nationally known respected scholars. But why would they stay? Some may stay because they are part of a couple, but the others?

Date: Sep 9, 2004

Let's see . . . Woodrick gets a few months notice, Glamser and Stringer get locked out of their offices, Pood tried to fire Polk before he quits, Whiting gets the favorable tenure and promotion letter but no contract, Sulentic gets no contract even after her 3rd year review won its appeal -- these are only a few that are coming off the top of my clown hat - what is up with this place?

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by: Lamont Cranston
" USM, as an institution of higher education, is in some very serious difficulties. The manner with which this matter was handled exacerbates the problem even more: 1. A termination letter should come from the chair - not from the dean.

No. The Board terminates faculty. A termination recommendation may come from the chair, but a chair cannot terminate a tenured faculty member.

Was the chair notified, consulted, or informed as to what was happening?

Perhaps this is why Angela resigned?

Does USM still have a system of department chairs within its organizational scheme? If so, do they have any role whatsoever in personnel matters such as this?

You grossly overestimate the authority of the chair. A department head would have more authority and autonomy than a chair, and perhaps could play a bigger role here, but that is not the system we have. It is the Dean that is very powerful in the current USM structure.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

Originally posted by: Lamont Cranston:

A termination letter should come from the chair - not from the dean.

Reply by COST faculty:

No. The Board terminates faculty. A termination recommendation may come from the chair, but a chair cannot terminate a tenured faculty member.

Hello Cost faculty. Please note that my statement read "A termination letter should come from the chair - not the dean." The Board certainly has ultimate authority. But, as I said, the termination letter should come from the chair. Sorry, but I am quite sure I am correct on that point. Been there, done that.

Date: Sep 9, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Music Patron
"The sad thing is that there still are associate and assistant professors in the English department (Weinauer, Barron, Wallace, Kuskin, Villaponteax sp?) that have the potential to become nationally known respected scholars. But why would they stay? Some may stay because they are part of a couple, but the others? "

Being a part of a couple didn't stop the Kimbers in the music department. They went from two tenured positions to one untenured one to get out of USM.

Date: Sep 10, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Limping Eagle
"It appears to me that if USM's English department continues lose significant faculty at the rate is has this year it will be undistinguished. It will, however, probably be large (I understand the liberal arts dean told the new chair the losses would be replaced). But will those "replacements" consist of visible scholars? "

It is pretty clear that the Thames administration, despite all of its verbiage about Carnegie I and "research university" does not care about research, at least not research in the humanities that does not bring in big grants. The loss of Gary Stringer and Noel Polk is tremendous. These are scholars with reputations outside of a ten-mile radius. Shelboo does not seem to recognize that there is an academic world outside of Mississippi. Pood obviously doesn't recognize this either. Noel Polk's departure means that once again, USM looses a toe. It is looking pretty maimed at this point. No scholar that already has a "visible" reputation would go to USM, which is, after all, a 4th tier university. At best, it will be able to hire good new PhDs desperate for a job, who will stay a few years and move on. When they mature and do their best work, they will no longer be at USM.

Date: Sep 10, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: foot soldier
" It is pretty clear that the Thames administration, despite all of its verbiage about Carnegie I and "research university" does not care about research, at least not research in the humanities that does not bring in big grants. The loss of Gary Stringer and Noel Polk is tremendous. These are scholars with reputations outside of a ten-mile radius. Shelboo does not seem to recognize that there is an academic world outside of Mississippi. Pood obviously doesn't recognize this either. Noel Polk's departure means that once again, USM looses a toe. It is looking pretty maimed at this point. No scholar that already has a "visible" reputation would go to USM, which is, after all, a 4th tier university. At best, it will be able to hire good new PhDs desperate for a job, who will stay a few years and move on. When they mature and do their best work, they will no longer be at USM."

FS, this is such an insightful post. You are absolutely right. Under SFT's non-rule, the great reputation of the humanities depts. are being systematically destroyed. Whole depts. are being decimated. My sadness as an alum and current PhD student is beyond words.

Date: Sep 10, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: foot soldier
"It is pretty clear that the Thames administration, despite all of its verbiage about Carnegie I and "research university" does not care about research, at least not research in the humanities that does not bring in big grants."

FS, you're close to hitting the nail on the head. I think it's not so much that the Thames administration doesn't care about research in the humanities so much as the head guy himself doesn't consider it to be "research." If it ain't done with a separatory funnel & distillation column, it ain't "research." And "if yore so smart, whah ain't yew rich?"

But yeah,

is what it's about. Or rather, it's about a lot of misconceptions about

Date: Sep 10, 2004

I spoke with a born and bred southern Mississippian (and USM undergrad/grad alum) today who has lived all over the country. This person, who was good friends with Horace Fleming, provided me with some interesting insights. In no particular order, some quotes:

"People in other parts of the country make fun of Mississippi and it makes me so angry because I know what a treasure we have here in South Mississippi. Then I see what's going on at the university and I realize that we give them the fodder for their disdain."

"The difference between Horace and Aubrey is that Horace wanted the world to know that we were quality and on the move while Aubrey knew that we were quality and wanted to keep it a well-kept secret. Shelby is so different from each of them. He wouldn't know quality if he saw it but he makes lots of noise anyway and brings us the wrong kind of national attention."

"Tim Hudson has a reputation as being slippery from long before his days of working for Shelby. He may want to come back as president but there are alot of people with long memories who will see to it that it won't happen."

"Losing Noel Polk is more than just a loss for the university. Having him as a part of the local community has been a source of bragging rights."

"You would think that the Office of Affirmative Action would be the last one on campus to get down-sized."

Date: Sep 11, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Invictus
"

FS, you're close to hitting the nail on the head. I think it's not so much that the Thames administration doesn't care about research in the humanities so much as the head guy himself doesn't consider it to be "research." "

I've said this before in earlier posts. For me early on, the most telling incident was the founding of the "innovation" awards. The categories are "pure, applied, and creative," I believe. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but so far, no one in the liberal arts buildling has won one. It's been scientists, social scientists, and two people in music. I guess technically humanities research is "pure" but I'm sure Noel Polk or Gary Stringer would never have beat out a scientist. Shelboo does not know what a university is. In fact, he's probably happy that Stringer and Polk are gone. On some level he got what he wanted.

Date: Sep 11, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by: foot soldier
"

. . . . . . the founding of the "innovation" awards. The categories are "pure, applied, and creative . . . "

I have a nomination for the "creative" award, foot soldier, and it is not for someone in the traditionally "creative" areas of art, music, or drama. It is for whomever set up the administrative system currently employed at USM. A more original and creative system I have never seen. It is so original and creative that no good university in America would even dream of using it.

Date: Sep 11, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: foot soldier
" I've said this before in earlier posts. For me early on, the most telling incident was the founding of the "innovation" awards. The categories are "pure, applied, and creative," I believe. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but so far, no one in the liberal arts buildling has won one. It's been scientists, social scientists, and two people in music. I guess technically humanities research is "pure" but I'm sure Noel Polk or Gary Stringer would never have beat out a scientist. Shelboo does not know what a university is. In fact, he's probably happy that Stringer and Polk are gone. On some level he got what he wanted."

Actually,these awards are not recent-they have been around for years (decades). A couple of years ago the label "innovation" was placed on them, and the awards were made meaningful both in terms of cash and acknowledgment (I received one in the 90's, and only received pocket change after taxes and some cheesy plaque). However, if you include winners from all years, not just the past couple of years since the "innovation" label, I believe that we have had people from the humanities (I'd have to do some serious research to get the names).

As a person who was involved in the selection process for these for many years, I can tell you that the number of applications for these from the humanities AND performance arts (exclusive of music) tends to be small in comparison to other disciplines. The dome, no matter who was on the throne, never interferred in the selection process, and the committee engaged in outreach to the colleges in the hope of getting increased participation from other disciplines. I think many of the folks doing outstanding SCHOLARSHIP (I prefer that term) in various disciplines across campus (for example, we have some great writers and theatre people here) would be highly competitive if they just get nominated by their colleagues and follow up by submitting a dossier.

I am now longer involved in the process, but I would STRONGLY ENCOURAGE folks to nominate the lions in your discipline this year. The only fair test of FS's hypothesis is to see adequate representation by all scholars on campus! The selection committee started to use external reviewers in the applicant's field for finalists, so this is a tough competition. Put your best scholars forward, and let's revisit this issue next year.