Great letter today - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Jun 20, 2004

Great letter today

Date: Jun 20, 2004

I agree - great letter. Well-written and to the point. Now we can wait to see if Seeker feels that this letter "doesn't help the cause" or confuses the public that Seeker feels the faculty must have behind them to successfully oust SFT. But, since Glamser and Stringer are "dregs," the public should disagree with this letter and be happy to be rid of these professors....

Date: Jun 20, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by: Music Patron
"Great letter in the American today. Thanks to the writer.

The writer is of course our own LVN! Thanks, Linda.

Jo

Date: Jun 20, 2004

After a letter like that, perhaps somebody should send you flowers!

Date: Jun 20, 2004

Thanks for all the kind remarks. The letter was edited somewhat, I had said "notorious criminal professor" which got zapped. Actually was surprised it got printed.

Date: Jun 20, 2004

"Stringer will be taking his million-dollar, world-famous National Endowment for the Humanities grant"

Actually about 50K/year, with a chunk of it coming from AD in matching funds. The million dollar number comes over the whole history of the grant.

We should keep everything above board in not challengable.

Date: Jun 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: accuracy in media
""Stringer will be taking his million-dollar, world-famous National Endowment for the Humanities grant" Actually about 50K/year, with a chunk of it coming from AD in matching funds. The million dollar number comes over the whole history of the grant. We should keep everything above board in not challengable."

"All I know is what I read in the papers."

Since i'm not a USM person, I suppose I could be forgiven this lapse. Your point is taken, however.

Date: Jun 20, 2004

Who cares about the actual dollar figures? Fact is, USM is losing an internationally respected man of the arts, and he's taking his internationally recognized project with him. Any way you look at it, it's a great loss for USM (and Hettiesburg - ask anybody at Trinity Episcopal), a great gain for A&M, and another toe blown away by Shelby.

Date: Jun 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: accuracy in media
""Stringer will be taking his million-dollar, world-famous National Endowment for the Humanities grant"
Actually about 50K/year, with a chunk of it coming from AD in matching funds. The million dollar number comes over the whole history of the grant.
We should keep everything above board in not challengable."

Actually, it's a million dollar grant that's been ongoing for many years.

Yes, the university put up matching funds & there are those of us here who believe that one reason Dr. Stringer became a "marked man" was that somebody got tired of paying the match, especially when John Donne doesn't spin off a lot of pseudo-private sector "businesses."

OTOH, TAMU felt the match was a small price to pay for the visibility.

Date: Jun 20, 2004

Forgot to add that the "chunk" contributed by AD can't be that big, because AD hasn't been around that long. Anyway, I was unaware that the VP for Research contributed match funds personally. I thought match funds were contributed by the university...

Date: Jun 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Lewis and Gilbert
"Who cares about the actual dollar figures? Fact is, USM is losing an internationally respected man of the arts, and he's taking his internationally recognized project with him. Any way you look at it, it's a great loss for USM (and Hettiesburg - ask anybody at Trinity Episcopal), a great gain for A&M, and another toe blown away by Shelby. "

As a matter of fact, I've just flown in from a week long professional event that had approx. 350 English instructors there -- colleagues from a diverse number of universities were quite alarmed about recent USM events since what happens here, can open the door to it happening anywhere. However, one person saw me sporting a USM ballcap and came up to me about it since his parents are relocating to Hattiesburg from California in a couple of months - they're taking advantage of the retirement perks. He told me that he was so impressed with USM because of the presence of "Gary Stringer, the Donne scholar". He went on about the tremendous English Department, and I told him the lowdown. Imagine his dismay - I kept reassuring him that Hattiesburg was still a great place to relocate - as long as it wasn't university related. I gave several of my colleagues from various universities Tshirts, and they assured me that they'll proudly wear them when they get back home.

Date: Jun 20, 2004

btw ------

NO QUARTER

Date: Jun 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Invictus
"Forgot to add that the "chunk" contributed by AD can't be that big, ...I thought match funds were contributed by the university..."

I had supper this evening with a retired university professor. Based on our conversation, I wonder just how many matching "funds" were contributed. I understand that those matches are generally in kind. The university provides office space, use of the phone, computers, etc. I don't mean to minimize that contribution, but it is not the same as hard cold dollars, is it?

Does anyone know exactly what the "match" was in this case?

Date: Jun 21, 2004

Well, we can all breathe easier now that professor Gary Stringer will be taking his million-dollar, world-famous National Endowment for the Humanities grant and leaving us for Texas A&M. And taking his musician wife, professor Mary Ann Stringer with him.

It was brilliant of University of Southern Mississippi President Shelby Thames to get rid of two faculty members in one fell swoop. Three, if we count professor Frank Glamser. How efficient!

Way to go, Dr. Thames and friends at the Institutions of Higher Learning. This is an important step towards the establishment of a fine technical institute where a real university used to be.

Linda Nunes

If this is the letter that you guys were refering to it is a much better letter than the one penned by Joe Parker last week. It addresses an issue, states the case and refrains from name calling.

While I have zero interest in John Donne, and it boggles my mind how someone can devote 20+ years to a project where the aforementioned poet only wrote 400 pages of prose, I am sure that it is a very important project if our federal government can devote more than $1m a year to it. I am sure that a great number of you quote John Donne on a daily basis, and are enlightend by his writings. I wish that Dr. Stringer had not put himself in the position that he did, I am sure that he learned from the experience and will be a better Proff at TAMU for it. Now Mary Ann Stringer, she is a very talented individual.

This letter didn't hurt your cause in the area of public opinion.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Seeker
"
While I have zero interest in John Donne, and it boggles my mind how someone can devote 20+ years to a project where the aforementioned poet only wrote 400 pages of prose, I am sure that it is a very important project if our federal government can devote more than $1m a year to it."

I think it's been stated repeatedly here that the grant was $1M over the life of the grant ... more like $50K per year. But my real point in quoting you Seeker, is to take issue with the idea that a poet wrote only about 400 pages of prose. Pedantically-speaking, this sort of gaffé speaks volumes about what the USM English Department is accomplishing with the majority of students who traipse through its hallowed halls.

This letter didn't hurt your cause in the area of public opinion. "

I agree. It was a very good letter. No name-calling. Just tellin' it like it is.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

This letter didn't hurt your cause in the area of public opinion.

Seeker - I appreciate your dedication to USM - let's get that straight.

I also appreciate your lack of appreciation for the arts - that's perfectly fine, and probably not uncommon in your circle of family and friends.

However, I really don't care whether or not you feel that letters to the editor are "helping the cause." I'm now convinced that the feelings of the court of public opinion will have little to do with how all of this turns out - most of the public around Hattiesburg appear to care less (in the big scheme of things), and the ones that do are unlikely to be swayed one way or the other. In other words, slightly radical letters to the HA are not going to change much. Just my opinion, you dreg.....

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Seeker
"I am sure that a great number of you quote John Donne on a daily basis, and are enlightend by his writings. I wish that Dr. Stringer had not put himself in the position that he did, I am sure that he learned from the experience and will be a better Proff at TAMU for it."

Seeker,

If Gary Stringer is as guilty of unethical and possibily illegal conduct as you seem to think, can you please explain why a top-rank university such as TAMU snapped him up immediately? Apparently some highly informed and highly intelligent people in College Station -- including, presumably, the legal staff at TAMU -- don't think he did anything illegal or even anything to be remotely ashamed of. TAMU is quite happy to have him, whereas you, Shelby Thames, and Roy Klumb are apparently among the dwindling band of people who think he did anything illegal or reprehensible. What objective EVIDENCE do you have to support your contention? We Stringer-supporters now have the objective EVIDENCE that a major university is more than happy to immediately hire this alleged criminal and no-goodnik (as Boris or Natasha from *Rocky and Bullwinkle* might put it).

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: The Rock
" I'm now convinced that the feelings of the court of public opinion will have little to do with how all of this turns out - most of the public around Hattiesburg appear to care less (in the big scheme of things), and the ones that do are unlikely to be swayed one way or the other. In other words, slightly radical letters to the HA are not going to change much.

I am afraid that you are right Rock. Most people out there really don't care, and not as many read the paper as we would like to think. But does that mean we should stop writing? I've had two letters published, and that means I should stop, and other people should write. I really want to believe that a steady steam of thoughtful letters (mine was being smart, not thoughtful) may do some good over time.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: LVN
"I am afraid that you are right Rock. Most people out there really don't care, and not as many read the paper as we would like to think. But does that mean we should stop writing? I've had two letters published, and that means I should stop, and other people should write. I really want to believe that a steady steam of thoughtful letters (mine was being smart, not thoughtful) may do some good over time. "

LVN,

I suspect that the longer the issue is kept alive in public, the weaker, ultimately, SFT becomes. Surely he wants this whole thing to just go away, and in fact the PR moves he has been making in the last month or so suggest that the controversy HAS already hurt him. I hope that others on this board will follow your fine example and will continue to pepper the papers with letters. I have a feeling that the energy level will pick up once the fall term begins and SFT has to begin making more of the wise and thoughtful decisions for which he is so famous.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

"I suspect that the longer the issue is kept alive in public, the weaker, ultimately, SFT becomes. Surely he wants this whole thing to just go away, and in fact the PR moves he has been making in the last month or so suggest that the controversy HAS already hurt him. I hope that others on this board will follow your fine example and will continue to pepper the papers with letters. I have a feeling that the energy level will pick up once the fall term begins and SFT has to begin making more of the wise and thoughtful decisions for which he is so famous."

Hey, don't get me wrong - I say keep the pressure on as much as possible. I was just trying to relieve Seeker of his duty of preaching to us about how certain letters and actions will or won't sway the "public." I would like to see letters dropped from the sky onto Hattiesburg to let the "people" know what's going on. I'm just tired of getting "Seeker Sermons" every time a slightly radical letter appears in the paper. NO quarter, NO quarter, NO quarter!

Date: Jun 21, 2004

Time wounds all heels!!!

SFT counted on this "going away" with less letters, less publicity, less discussion - but it's not happening. Sure, it's summertime, and naturally a lull exists - but not for long. We're less than 2 months away from the fall semester, and it's important to keep the issues in the media and to keep talking. I think the public that truly cares about USM are horrified by the administration's behavior. I've sat with this cast of characters and listened to them spin their deceptive historical revisions that come out more hysterical than historical. And, when you sit there and listen to what amounts to be nothing but blatant lies - you are stunned by their audacity and simply sit there and listen rather than arguing with them. I've been there.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
"Time wounds all heels!!!
SFT counted on this "going away" with less letters, less publicity, less discussion - but it's not happening. Sure, it's summertime, and naturally a lull exists - but not for long. We're less than 2 months away from the fall semester, and it's important to keep the issues in the media and to keep talking. I think the public that truly cares about USM are horrified by the administration's behavior. I've sat with this cast of characters and listened to them spin their deceptive historical revisions that come out more hysterical than historical. And, when you sit there and listen to what amounts to be nothing but blatant lies - you are stunned by their audacity and simply sit there and listen rather than arguing with them. I've been there."

See I agree with this both sides need to keep voicing opinions. Despite what you guys think I know that there are very real problems on campus. Were we disagree is that 100% of the blame should be layed at Thames feet. There are enough problems and enough blame to go around. It should be shared - admin, faculty, former admin, college board, unconcerned alumni, ect. We need a clean slate at Southern Miss.

Both sides should continue with the letter writing, they just need to be more civil in their mannger.

Share the Blame.....Clean Slate

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Seeker
"

See I agree with this both sides need to keep voicing opinions. Despite what you guys think I know that there are very real problems on campus. Were we disagree is that 100% of the blame should be layed at Thames feet. There are enough problems and enough blame to go around. It should be shared - admin, faculty, former admin, college board, unconcerned alumni, ect. We need a clean slate at Southern Miss.

Both sides should continue with the letter writing, they just need to be more civil in their mannger.

Share the Blame.....Clean Slate"

But Seeker, when you are asked what problems (or blame) you attribute to the faculty you just make more assertions. The best that you came up with was "you thought the faculty leaders didn't have as much political connections with the public as SFT". Surely you have more on the faculty than that to say negative things about G&S, Henry etc.

Also please define "clean slate". Do you propose to fire faculty because they don't "connect" with the public as much as SFT in his home town???

Date: Jun 21, 2004

Newgirl

I know Hattiesburg is SFT's hometown, but you have faculty members who have been professors here for 20 years or more, surly at some point during that time Hattiesburg had to become their hometown as well.

I do not think that all faculty members need to be fired. All of the SFT admin needs to be fired. I think that about 12-15 facutly members need to be fired, because they will not be satisfied with any admin that requires any measure of accountability from them. Yes, some of them are outspoken leaders among the faculty some are not. Some of these individuals have no other goal than to be outspoken radicals who have little care for the students, the university or the rest of you who are suffering.

Yes I know you guys are suffering, but it's a small percent of your own that has brought about a good deal of your problems. I know you will never believe or accept this, you will just throw more questions at me that you don't really want to know answers for. But, you could have helped yourself so much early on in the SFT admin, but you (your leadership) dropped the ball.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Seeker
"I think that about 12-15 facutly members need to be fired, . . . "

Seeker--

Name names. Put up or shut up.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

"Name names. Put up or shut up."

I agree - you've already called Glamser and Stringer "the dregs," let us know you don't care for Noel Polk, etc. Why get all honorable on us now? But, before you name these names, let us know whether or not that professor gave you a bad grade, which I strongly suspect could be the case fro your beef with some of those professors....

Date: Jun 21, 2004

This University has already lost more than its share of fine faculty. We can only begin with the teaching of Glamser, the research of Stringer and Weisenberg, the creative writing of Robison, the performances of Kimber, the teacher education skills of Malone--the list goes on and on and on--and the students are much the worse for it because all these teachers enriched the lives of the students--both in and out of the classrooms. Yes, hires will continue to be made--young people need jobs. But when you look at the list of departures, you see how many experienced, successful senior people are leaving.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

To clarify what it means to have Hattiesburg as your hometown. Much of Hattiesburg considers you an outsider unless your grandparents were born in Hattiesburg. Though I was born and grew up in Hattiesburg, since my parents did not, we were outsiders. The term hometown has a special meaning in Hattiesburg.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Seeker
" it's a small percent of your own that has brought about a good deal of your problems. "

Seeker--

Name names. Put up or shut up.

Date: Jun 21, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: USM Sympathizer
" Seeker, If Gary Stringer is as guilty of unethical and possibily illegal conduct as you seem to think, can you please explain why a top-rank university such as TAMU snapped him up immediately? Apparently some highly informed and highly intelligent people in College Station -- including, presumably, the legal staff at TAMU -- don't think he did anything illegal or even anything to be remotely ashamed of. TAMU is quite happy to have him, whereas you, Shelby Thames, and Roy Klumb are apparently among the dwindling band of people who think he did anything illegal or reprehensible. What objective EVIDENCE do you have to support your contention? We Stringer-supporters now have the objective EVIDENCE that a major university is more than happy to immediately hire this alleged criminal and no-goodnik (as Boris or Natasha from *Rocky and Bullwinkle* might put it)."

Seeker,

As long as you are responding to questions, please also respond to the ones mentioned above. Thanks.