SFT, SACS and The Board - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: May 19, 2005

SFT, SACS and The Board

Date: May 19, 2005

Cossack,

Won't the Board point to the new strong-commissioner system as a safeguard against disregarding accreditation in the future?

Robert Campbell

Date: May 19, 2005

The Board can point at the change, but the Board put SFT in Place and they have kept him place in spite of his obvious weaknesses in taking SACS serious. You have not been fooled by the Board's action, so why would SACS be taken in?

Date: May 19, 2005

SACS has little interest in all of this. If anything, they value stability in administrative staff, so SFT staying two years is a positive. They go out of their way to stay out of personnel decisions.

Date: May 19, 2005

SACSpert,

Are you implying that SACS will now lift the probation just because Thames won't be leaving before December of this year?

Robert Campbell

Date: May 19, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: SACspert
"SACS has little interest in all of this. If anything, they value stability in administrative staff, so SFT staying two years is a positive. They go out of their way to stay out of personnel decisions."

I'm positive that you know a lot more about SACS than I do, but then why is it that whenever SACS comes down hard on a school, almost inevitably the first thing that happens is that the president resigns or is fired? I think there is still a very good chance that SACS (and other accrediting agencies) will be coming down hard on USM. He has made a royal mess of things in so many ways that these agencies would be neglecting their duties if they did not raise very serious concerns when the times come for evaluation of USM.

Date: May 19, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: USM Sympathizer
"He has made a royal mess of things in so many ways that these agencies would be neglecting their duties if they did not raise very serious concerns when the times come for evaluation of USM."

USM Sympathizer,

An equally important issue is how this mess will affect the search for a new USM president. Any presidential candidate will undoubtedly ask, "What's this stuff about Thames?" to which people will respond, "Well . . . . It's like this." And then the same candidate will ask, "What's this stuff about Fleming?" to which people will respond, "Well . . . It's like this." Explaining how two consecutive presidents were given one year extensions is not going to be an easy task for anybody (including the IHL).

Date: May 19, 2005

SACS is a paper tiger. And it won't do anything to USM beyond a possible extension of probation. I can't understand Cossack's fascination with SACS. He posts again and again about SACS and how SACS will get USM, Thames, and the IHL. Will not happen.

Date: May 19, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Soft Shoe Shuffle
" USM Sympathizer, An equally important issue is how this mess will affect the search for a new USM president. Any presidential candidate will undoubtedly ask, "What's this stuff about Thames?" to which people will respond, "Well . . . . It's like this." And then the same candidate will ask, "What's this stuff about Fleming?" to which people will respond, "Well . . . It's like this." Explaining how two consecutive presidents were given one year extensions is not going to be an easy task for anybody (including the IHL). "

I expect that search will begin next year. No one doubts my love for Southern Miss. I have already asked for, and gotten approval, to serve on the search committee for the new President. I expressed that desire to the IHL, and even told them I would take on the arduous task of committee chairman. I want to see the best candidate get the job.

SBT

Date: May 19, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: No Problem
" I expect that search will begin next year. No one doubts my love for Southern Miss. I have already asked for, and gotten approval, to serve on the search committee for the new President. I expressed that desire to the IHL, and even told them I would take on the arduous task of committee chairman. I want to see the best candidate get the job. SBT"

Holy Toledo!

Date: May 19, 2005

It's SFT, unless you're being funny.

Date: May 19, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Soft Shoe Shuffle
" USM Sympathizer, An equally important issue is how this mess will affect the search for a new USM president. Any presidential candidate will undoubtedly ask, "What's this stuff about Thames?" to which people will respond, "Well . . . . It's like this." And then the same candidate will ask, "What's this stuff about Fleming?" to which people will respond, "Well . . . It's like this." Explaining how two consecutive presidents were given one year extensions is not going to be an easy task for anybody (including the IHL). "

You make an excellent point. Fortunately (or not), there are a lot of ambitious people out there who think they can and will succeed at anything they do and that they will be the exceptions to any precedents. Maybe that's the kind of thinking it takes to be an administrator, especially a president. Perhaps the best choice would be someone who knows USM; several people have mentioned Don Cotten. Would Joe Paul be eligible or qualified? I have rarely heard a negative word about him on this board. My personal nominees would be Gary Stringer or Frank Glamser, if only to see the look on Shelby's face!

Date: May 19, 2005

Joe Paul should never be considered for any job other than the one he has. He is a true admin lightweight. He survives by saying yes a lot and remaining below the radar. My impression is that in cabinet meetings that he is the Ed McMahanon of the deal. Saying "hyyyohhh" every now and again when Johnny (Aubrey, Horace, SFT) says something interesting. In the end JP is nice enough, but he blows with the prevailing wind to keep his high paying and seemingly rather easy job.

Date: May 20, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Whammer
"SACS is a paper tiger. And it won't do anything to USM beyond a possible extension of probation. I can't understand Cossack's fascination with SACS. He posts again and again about SACS and how SACS will get USM, Thames, and the IHL. Will not happen."

If the Board thought SACS was a paper tiger, wouldn't yesterday's headlines have read "Shelby Freland Thames: President for Life"?

RC

Date: May 20, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: USM Sympathizer
" My personal nominees would be Gary Stringer or Frank Glamser, if only to see the look on Shelby's face!"

I second those nominations. Either of them.

Date: May 20, 2005

let me add to rc's comment about SACS. i know there's another thread thanking the FS and the AAUP. i think the real thanks goes to SACS. ST survived a lot, but he couldn't survive a SACS probation and a SACS consultant. i think the SACS consultant was amazed at how bad the "atmosphere" is at USM--how trust is virtually non-existent (between faculty and administration, and sadly, between faculty and faculty). i suspect she communicated that to the Board. sometimes it takes an outsider's perspective, one not affiliated with either side, to get people's attention.

Date: May 20, 2005

Whammer may be right. However, Auburn did not think SACS was a paper tiger. A President was fired and a Board member was moved to a lesser profile position with less clout. If there were bookmakers quoting odds on USM surviving a scheduled SACS visit with SFT at the helm, would the odds reflect my perception or Whammer's? Even assuming that SACS is somewhat of a paper tiger, USM presents a opportunity for SACS to flex its muscles and gain reputational capital. If SACS lets USM go, then it will have demonstrated it is not going to use its power and it will have lost more. The next Auburn will go the USM route and dare SACS to act.

Date: May 20, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Cossack
"Whammer may be right. However, Auburn did not think SACS was a paper tiger. A President was fired and a Board member was moved to a lesser profile position with less clout. If there were bookmakers quoting odds on USM surviving a scheduled SACS visit with SFT at the helm, would the odds reflect my perception or Whammer's? Even assuming that SACS is somewhat of a paper tiger, USM presents a opportunity for SACS to flex its muscles and gain reputational capital. If SACS lets USM go, then it will have demonstrated it is not going to use its power and it will have lost more. The next Auburn will go the USM route and dare SACS to act. "

Excellent post; SFT has put USM in a great position to be the SACS whipping boy. I know people at Auburn and I can guarantee you that Auburn took SACS very seriously; in fact, the governor of Alabama himself took SACS very seriously. It was the governor himself who unilaterally replaced the former president (he is ex-officio president of the Auburn board) and appointed a new one specifically to deal with SACS; it was announced in the papers that dealing with SACS was Job 1 for the new president. Anyone who thinks SACS is to be messed with is being very foolish. On my own campus, the need to conform to SACS guidelines is something constantly stressed and constantly in the minds of all administrators and faculty.

Date: May 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: USM Sympathizer
"Excellent post; SFT has put USM in a great position to be the SACS whipping boy. I know people at Auburn and I can guarantee you that Auburn took SACS very seriously; in fact, the governor of Alabama himself took SACS very seriously. It was the governor himself who unilaterally replaced the former president (he is ex-officio president of the Auburn board) and appointed a new one specifically to deal with SACS; it was announced in the papers that dealing with SACS was Job 1 for the new president. Anyone who thinks SACS is to be messed with is being very foolish. On my own campus, the need to conform to SACS guidelines is something constantly stressed and constantly in the minds of all administrators and faculty."

I've seen this here. It is true.