See More #55 - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Mar 21, 2005

See More #55

Date: Mar 21, 2005

This is exactly the kind of thing that hurts the image of USM faculty when viewed by outsiders. The Business people in town who have begun frequenting this board are going to see that and say "those professors act like middle-school children" and they'll be right.

Time to take up issues and stop playing yah-yah games. See More is bad for the faculty's image.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

I resemble that! See More is obviously outsourcing to an elementary school! (This is one of SM's lesser issues, IMO.)

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Image Consultant
"This is exactly the kind of thing that hurts the image of USM faculty when viewed by outsiders. The Business people in town who have begun frequenting this board are going to see that and say "those professors act like middle-school children" and they'll be right. Time to take up issues and stop playing yah-yah games. See More is bad for the faculty's image."

Why would an anonymous post that could be created by anyone--even a disgruntled member of the administration--hurt the faculty?

Satire is a time-honored weapon (metaphor alert!) against unreasonable oppression. You might as well claim that the local business people are going to get upset about political cartoons. I am sure that people who can stay solvent in a free enterprise system have enough smarts to sort out humor in context.

Jameela

Date: Mar 21, 2005

Ivory Tower Alert!

Another case of an illogical conclusion. Just because someone acts rationally in conducting a business doesn't mean that they don't act in an irrational manner otherwise. Image Consultant is correct that once people from the community start seeing this, they will find it mean-spirited. Not everyone understands satire. And yes, you do have to "dumb it down" for your audience. Maybe you shouldn't have to, but you do. It's a fact of life.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Big Blue
"And yes, you do have to "dumb it down" for your audience. Maybe you shouldn't have to, but you do. It's a fact of life."

I don't think so. No more than we have to dumb down the content of a course orr alter the content of a book. I, for one, will not let someone with a faded sense of humor erode my own sense of humor.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Frowny
"I don't think so. No more than we have to dumb down the content of a course orr alter the content of a book. I, for one, will not let someone with a faded sense of humor erode my own sense of humor. "

While you're literally correct, "Big Blue" is making a lot of sense. You, or we, don't "have to" dumb down anything, but if we wish to win over the target audience of Hattiesburg non-academics, we would be well advised to do so. This has nothing whatever to do with eroding your sense of humor. It has to do with tailoring the message to the intended audience, rather than perpetuating a tone that's guaranteed to alienate them. This is exactly what Thames and Mader have been doing for the past two years, and with great success. It ain't rocket science.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

Perhaps those who are easily offended ought to mosey on over to EagleTalk where a recent poster offered up a cigar smoking "smiley" with a machine gun shooting at professors.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

I must be missing something. Why would anybody find this week's SeeMore cartoon any more offensive than the previous ones? This is the most innocuous one of them all. Just a little guy in a beanie hat and a propeller spinning. The accompaning "World Class" caption was brief. Just what am I missing?

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Offended Eagle
"Perhaps those who are easily offended ought to mosey on over to EagleTalk where a recent poster offered up a cigar smoking "smiley" with a machine gun shooting at professors."

You're totally missing the point made by Big Blue and Media Advisor, which is precisely why we consistently lose the media battles. Whether or not posts on Eagle Talk are more tasteless, offensive, vulgar, whatever, has nothing to do with this particular issue. If we do not craft a message that appeals to the concerns of John Q. Hattiesburg, those folks will continue to dismiss us a a bunch of whining elitists. Satire is not everyone's cup of tea, certainly not Joe Sixpack's. Why is this so hard to grasp? A couple of weeks ago, there was a very incisive post from someone concerning the importance of appealing to your audience, rather than alienating them from the get-go. I'll try to find it and...KICK IT (sorry Ignoramus) up for a re-read.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

"...but if we wish to win over the target audience of Hattiesburg non-academics, we would be well advised to do so."

I think all Hattiesburg "non-academics" that claim to love USM that are jumping on the faculty should be ashamed of themselves. At no other respected university in the nation (or Mississippi, for that matter) is the faculty placed under so much pressure. You think that the faculty at Oxford would ever have to put up with this crud? At Baton Rouge? Starkville? It's just plain embarrassing. If USM is ever to be the "Harvard of the South," then the people of Hattiesburg will have to learn to respect what it takes to make a comprehensive university tick.

To those who want to see "new, young, inspired faculty that will come here and actually work, blah, blah...." come here, I pose this question: why the hell would these "ideal" professors want to come here when they have the "Hattiesburg non-academics" to deal with? It's not worth the stress! And most of the food in Hattiesburg is bad anyway....

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Elementary My Dear Watson
"Satire is not everyone's cup of tea, certainly not Joe Sixpack's."

I get the distinct impression that you know very little about Joe Sixpack. My family were all Joe Sixpack's, and so were their neighbors, and so was I. The Joe Sixpacks' sense of satire is at least as sophisticated as my Ph.D. colleagues. The Joe Sixpacks that I know would appreciate See More immensly. Please don't underestimate we Joe Sixpacks.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Elementary My Dear Watson
"You're totally missing the point made by Big Blue and Media Advisor, which is precisely why we consistently lose the media battles. Whether or not posts on Eagle Talk are more tasteless, offensive, vulgar, whatever, has nothing to do with this particular issue. If we do not craft a message that appeals to the concerns of John Q. Hattiesburg, those folks will continue to dismiss us a a bunch of whining elitists. Satire is not everyone's cup of tea, certainly not Joe Sixpack's. Why is this so hard to grasp? A couple of weeks ago, there was a very incisive post from someone concerning the importance of appealing to your audience, rather than alienating them from the get-go. I'll try to find it and...KICK IT (sorry Ignoramus) up for a re-read."

I know the incisive post of which you speak and the irony doesn't escape me. Unless an AAUP officer or the WebMaster posts that all new messages should be targeted to the concerns of JQH (although I'm sure that irks our many coast friends) then I believe this website should continue to be the vehicle of communication that it and its predecessor have been for a little over a year now.

SeeMore is a welcome addition to Monday mornings and the satire is as entertaining as that of other cartoonists including Marshall Ramsey.

As far as comparisons to the EagleTalk threads go, in general I would agree and in general I stay away from the posts there that I find inane or offensive. However, with the recent reports about faculty-incited or threatened violence, reports which were not only ludicrous on their face but lifted entirely out of context, I don't believe that pointing to another popular community website that has a much more direct, offensive, and violent post is irrelevant.

You and I are each using new names so neither of us has any board credibility. As such, I would argue that you have no right to criticize SeeMore, who has been posting weekly since the Glamser/Stringer tragedy, and I have no room to criticize you. I suggest that we allow the website organizers to give us direction if it is warranted.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

Right on, Bubba. Some of the funniest and sharpest people I know are ole reg'lar working' folks like most of my nearest and dearest.
(I used to say that the smartest people in America were driving tractors. The business and practical skills involved in farming are as great or greater than in any other business I know about.)
And don't forget, Joe is the guy out there working overtime to send his kid to college.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Offended Eagle
" I know the incisive post of which you speak and the irony doesn't escape me. Unless an AAUP officer or the WebMaster posts that all new messages should be targeted to the concerns of JQH (although I'm sure that irks our many coast friends) then I believe this website should continue to be the vehicle of communication that it and its predecessor have been for a little over a year now. SeeMore is a welcome addition to Monday mornings and the satire is as entertaining as that of other cartoonists including Marshall Ramsey. As far as comparisons to the EagleTalk threads go, in general I would agree and in general I stay away from the posts there that I find inane or offensive. However, with the recent reports about faculty-incited or threatened violence, reports which were not only ludicrous on their face but lifted entirely out of context, I don't believe that pointing to another popular community website that has a much more direct, offensive, and violent post is irrelevant. You and I are each using new names so neither of us has any board credibility. As such, I would argue that you have no right to criticize SeeMore, who has been posting weekly since the Glamser/Stringer tragedy, and I have no room to criticize you. I suggest that we allow the website organizers to give us direction if it is warranted."

I'll take one more run at clarifying my position before I shut up and go earn my salary. If you'll examine this thread you'll see that I did not say, or even imply, that I was offended by the SeeMore cartoons and I certainly said nothing about them that even borders on critical. I believe the criticism was voiced by 'Image Consultant," not I. I enjoy the cartoons, which are always amusing, and sometimes hilarious. What I attempted to convey was my agreement with "Big Blue" and "Media Advisor" that those things we find humorous may be perceived as sophomoric and offensive by others who are now frequenting this message board. I believe this may now be a concern whereas in the past it was not, because of the open invitation by Mixon (or whomever) to the Hattiesburg business community to read the board. Having invited those non-academics into this forum, the dynamic, like it or not, has changed. This is no longer the cyber equivalent of sitting in the bar at 206 Front with your colleagues. Now there's a new audience, and it's an audience we'd like on our side. I don't care what you post, and I see no reason for direction from the webmaster or AAUP, but I do think that we all should be more sensitive in our choice of words, given the new "listeners." If you don't share that concern, fine, but I think there was practical wisdom in those earlier posts. As for board credibility, if use of a different screen name in and of itself impeaches one's credibility, then 90% of the posts here fall under that umbrella. Think about the merits, or lack thereof, of the argument, not whether you recognize the author's screen name. That's it for me. And now, like the old soldier, I'll just...fade away.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

Elementary,

You've raised some good points and, in the very process of raising them, you've helped put the cartoons (and other humor on the board) in a helpful context. Everyone who visits this board should realize that it is almost completely unmonitored. Anyone can post almost anything, as we have discovered thanks in part to the postings of so many trolls. People who visit the board should keep in mind your final suggestion that all arguments be evaluated on their intellectual merits and that the silly stuff should be ignored or merely smiled at.

Personally, when I first began posting to this board I tried to treat Shelby Thames with respect. I always tried to refer to him as "President Thames" or as "SFT." However, it did not take long for me to lose respect for him when I saw not only (1) how he behaves but also (2) how he explains his behavior. I cannot pretend a respect for him that I no longer even remotely feel. He has made USM a laughingstock in the eyes of the national academic community, so it's only fitting (in my opinion) that he gets laughed at a bit on this board.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Elementary My Dear Watson
" I'll take one more run at clarifying my position before I shut up and go earn my salary. If you'll examine this thread you'll see that I did not say, or even imply, that I was offended by the SeeMore cartoons and I certainly said nothing about them that even borders on critical. I believe the criticism was voiced by 'Image Consultant," not I. I enjoy the cartoons, which are always amusing, and sometimes hilarious. What I attempted to convey was my agreement with "Big Blue" and "Media Advisor" that those things we find humorous may be perceived as sophomoric and offensive by others who are now frequenting this message board. I believe this may now be a concern whereas in the past it was not, because of the open invitation by Mixon (or whomever) to the Hattiesburg business community to read the board. Having invited those non-academics into this forum, the dynamic, like it or not, has changed. This is no longer the cyber equivalent of sitting in the bar at 206 Front with your colleagues. Now there's a new audience, and it's an audience we'd like on our side. I don't care what you post, and I see no reason for direction from the webmaster or AAUP, but I do think that we all should be more sensitive in our choice of words, given the new "listeners." If you don't share that concern, fine, but I think there was practical wisdom in those earlier posts. As for board credibility, if use of a different screen name in and of itself impeaches one's credibility, then 90% of the posts here fall under that umbrella. Think about the merits, or lack thereof, of the argument, not whether you recognize the author's screen name. That's it for me. And now, like the old soldier, I'll just...fade away."

Kicking, for LeavingASAP.....

Date: Mar 21, 2005

Once you lose your sense of humor, it's over. Thames is the clown that has made this university a joke and a tragic circus. He's having fun, why can't I? This is still America by God, Mississippi maybe America's wasteland, but screw 'em, the local business people. I wish it were the days when you could have a duel and settle scores expediently. Bring it on in the Burg. Keep it up See More. Keep free speech alive. I won't be bought, and I won't buy jack in the burg.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

See More is the highlight of many a dreary Monday. I am positive that someday articles will discuss/highlight the tenacity and humor of what has now crossed a year of weekly postings. Warning to all: you take on See More, you take on me. Beware. BTW, nowhere has it been stated that MB can not have some fun. Without some comic relief, I'd think I was just the only one going nuts this year.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

See More is usually a bit more thoughtful than today's issue was. However, I maintain that "if you have a reputation for getting up early, you can sleep late a lot of days." The members of the USM faculty should be portraying themselves as hard-working, serious scholars, not Photoshop junkies.

See More is See More, and fun is fun. However, why do you want to hand someone a loaded gun so that they can shoot you with it?

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Image Consultant
"See More is usually a bit more thoughtful than today's issue was. However, I maintain that "if you have a reputation for getting up early, you can sleep late a lot of days." The members of the USM faculty should be portraying themselves as hard-working, serious scholars, not Photoshop junkies. See More is See More, and fun is fun. However, why do you want to hand someone a loaded gun so that they can shoot you with it?"

Image Consultant,

You have made some good and valid points. If See More's cartoons were the ONLY thing posted on this board, I would agree with you. However, anyone coming here looking for substantive arguments can easily find them (in fact, I am trying right now to create a thread that brings many of them together in one place). See More appears just once a week; anyone who judges this board based entirely on the single appearance of a weekly cartoon is not reading with an open mind. I do appreciate your concern, though; I am just not AS concerned as you are. Don't forget that some of the people who are MOST successful in influencing public opinion (this includes Rush Limbaugh, whatever you happen to think of him) use heavy doses of humor. If the board were entirely humorous I suspect we would be accused of being a bunch of pompous academics who take everything too seriously.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

Let's don't forget Dr. Seuss and his cartoonish views on Natzi Germany on the rise.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Image Consultant
"See More is bad for the faculty's image."

Image Consultant:

If you dislike See More, you would have hated Judge Cooley, or Night Chalker, and maybe even the flowers of Spring.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

I'll let other debate whether satire or its repression would be the greater insult to an intelligent viewer. I'll just be content to say "Thanks, See More" for being a consistent light in this prolonged darkness.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

other = others

Date: Mar 21, 2005

I think See More rocks...if people don't get the humor, then too bad for them. I think the trolls are trying to take our fun away from us. I won't let them do it!

NO QUARTER!

Truth

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: truth4usm/AH
"I think See More rocks...if people don't get the humor, then too bad for them. I think the trolls are trying to take our fun away from us. I won't let them do it!

NO QUARTER!

Truth"

So, am I now labeled a troll? I am the one who originally questioned See More.

Date: Mar 21, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Image Consultant
" So, am I now labeled a troll? I am the one who originally questioned See More."

IC,

Take a chill pill will ya! No one is labelling you anything. Truth4USM was making a broad statement about the trollish posting on the board of late. And they are, the trolls are trying to make us miserable, we won't let them.

I like SeeMore, he is a breath of fresh air somedays, and personally, I don't for the life of me understand why USM needs a plane. Unless of course that SFT and Klumb are both dressed in white suits and the short one is going "DA plane boss, DA plane".

Date: Mar 21, 2005

YPIR, thanks for the explanation. Of course, I always say, "if the troll shoe fits...."

Truth