Clearing the air - USM Forum -- Message Board

Date: Feb 28, 2005

Clearing the air

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: W.J. Johnson
" It was amazing to each of us to see how little is being contributed to economic development efforts among the faculty. There are only a handfull of people doing this work. Several of us expressed to Dr. Thames that only those who are should be recieving raises at the school. He agreed and said that this plan has been in force since he arrived. "

Oh, I see. Then this must the the basis for Dana Thames' generous raise(s), her groundbreaking work and herculean efforts in economic development, and the millions in research dollars she's brought to USM. Gimme a break....

Date: Feb 28, 2005

First of all I find it hard to believe you exist because you said a "friend" pointed you to this site and you just wanted to give us all a copy of the letter you sent to the SH. Fine...but why are you still here? If you had any kind of life you would have posted your letter and left. Instead you sit here arguing with the "low-life" faculty everyday. If you are really the kind of person you say you are, you must have better things to do with your time. (And, I'm sure your reply will be that I should too, but I'm a student, and with the joke Thames still calls a unviersity I really don't)

Only one quote I'd like to address:
"It was amazing to each of us to see how little is being contributed to economic development efforts among the faculty. "

HMMM....MAYBE THAT IS BECAUSE THEY ARE SO DAMN BUSY TRYING TO GET THE SCHOOL OFF SACS PROBATION!!!!!!

Now Miss Information I am pulling out my chalk...
I WILL NOT FEED THE TROLLS
I WILL NOT FEED THE TROLLS
I WILL NOT FEED THE TROLLS
I WILL NOT FEED THE TROLLS
I WILL NOT FEED THE T....

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: W.J. Johnson
"What you guys dont understand is that taxpayers are streched to the limit and some of the college's funding has to come from grants and contracts."

Oh, I think every employee of every state institution of higher learning, universities & community colleges, knows that the state is bankrupt.

As always, taxpayers want more services but they want to pay less taxes.

An institution with a declining academic ranking in the most-referenced system (USN&WR) in this country & one that is currently on probation from its accrediting agency is not an institution that is going to attract serious external funding, except from select outfits that are already "beholden" to someone at the institution & politically-arranged "gimmes". If anything, Thames has made it more difficult for faculty outside of a few "blessed" areas to get external funding.

"Something is happening here & you don't know what it is. Do you, Mister Jones?"

Date: Feb 28, 2005

On our visit there we were shown several things including results from the latest survey of faculty acitivities. It was amazing to each of us to see how little is being contributed to economic development efforts among the faculty. There are only a handfull of people doing this work. Several of us expressed to Dr. Thames that only those who are should be recieving raises at the school. He agreed and said that this plan has been in force since he arrived. He said that before he got in office nobody even collected this kind of information. What you guys dont understand is that taxpayers are streched to the limit and some of the college's funding has to come from grants and contracts. THose who are doing this good work should get the rewards. It is that simple.

I very much doubt that you are real - if you are real then you are a coward for hiding behind privileged access to an embattled university president.

As to the passage you wrote above, let me remind you that IT IS NOT, NOR HAS IT EVER BEEN, THE PURPOSE OF A PUBLIC INSTITUTION OF HIGHER LEARNING MERELY TO FUNNEL RESOURCES TO LOCAL FOR-PROFIT, PRIVATE COMPANIES. GO GET YOUR CORPORATE WELFARE SOMEWHERE ELSE AND LEAVE EDUCATION TO THE PEOPLE WHO KNOW HOW TO DO IT. DID YOU ASK SHELBY WHICH MAJORS HAVE THE MOST STUDENTS? YOU SHOULD - THEY AREN'T IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT. ONLY YOU BUSINESS OWNERS THINK ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT IS THE WAY TO GO AT THE UNIVERSITY, BECAUSE, SURPRISE, IT BENEFITS YOUR POCKETBOOK. MISSISSIPPI'S RESIDENTS GENERALLY THINK OTHERWISE, BUT YOU DON'T REALLY CARE ABOUT THE STUDENTS DO YOU?

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Angeline
"MISSISSIPPI'S RESIDENTS GENERALLY THINK OTHERWISE..."

Pessimistically speaking, most Mississippi residents generally don't think about it, one way or the other. But if you press them for an answer, they'll go ask their boss, who will tell them how to answer.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

I said it before, I'll say it again. Research dollars do not decrease the demand for academic dollars. Research is by law (and in reality) non-profit.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: W.J. Johnson
"What you guys dont understand is that taxpayers are streched to the limit"

W.J., it is apparent from your statement that you are not "one of us" - that is to say you were not born, raised, and educated in Mississippi. If you were a native and educated Mississippian, you would have surely detected that the "we're stretched to the limit" nonsense has been going on for decades. If you took a course in Mississippi history in Junior High School (now called "Middle School"), you would have some idea about the "plantation system" that has governed the Magnolia state since the pre- civil war era, e.g. "tell them that the man in the big white house on the hill can't afford indoor plumbing for the workers because we had a bad cotton crop this year." I've heard that line since I was a kid. You might be able to fool a Mississippi newbie, but you can't fool me.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

Look, this guy Johnson says he's gonna have a full 900 words in the "Un Herald"--that's the "Community Forum" length--to spin things Thames-ward, probably this week.

Does anyone here have connections enough with that "newspaper" to call Rie HArris or Stan Tiner or Ricky Matthews and ask for equal space/time?

It would also be a way to actually ascertain if this guy's for real.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: True Blue Mississippian
"W.J., it is apparent from your statement that you are not "one of us" - that is to say you were not born, raised, and educated in Mississippi. If you were a native and educated Mississippian, you would have surely detected that the "we're stretched to the limit" nonsense has been going on for decades. If you took a course in Mississippi history in Junior High School (now called "Middle School"), you would have some idea about the "plantation system" that has governed the Magnolia state since the pre- civil war era, e.g. "tell them that the man in the big white house on the hill can't afford indoor plumbing for the workers because we had a bad cotton crop this year." I've heard that line since I was a kid. You might be able to fool a Mississippi newbie, but you can't fool me. "

Well put, True Blue.

One may argue also that Mississippians are not stretched to the limit. Taxation is ludicrously low in this state, even though politicians bellow & trumpet about how they must lower taxes to be competitive with other states. The fact is that the state's "leadership" has squandered money for decades on useless projects & rewards for their pals.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: W.J. Johnson
"it has been arranged for me to write a longer Opinion for the Sun Herald. Having my letter appear there before hand would not work, as it was told to me. So I am working on my longer article now."

I'll believe it when I see it, W.J. In the meantime, I think you are a troll, although I do think that much of what you say does (unfortunately) reflect the real thinking of all-too-many real people.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

OK. Taking Dr. Watson's advice, I called Marie Harris at the "Un Herald"--lovely pun, doc--and asked her about "W.J. Johnson" and his claim to be writing a longer-than-letter-to-the- editor piece for them about the USM situation. She directs the editorial page, so it made sense she'd know.

She said they'd recently rejected a letter to the editor on this topic because the facts didn't check out. But she also said she knew nothing of any plan to run an op-ed length piece such as "W.J.Johnson" describes on this site.

Does this mean that "W.J. Johnson" is pulling our collective chain? There's some evidence this is so.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

Thanks, insurgent x! Until proven wrong, I remain convinced that W.J. is just a troll. Thanks for helping to confirm my suspicions.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

Looks like it's gonna be...

Date: Feb 28, 2005

Click to see the image

(Embedded troll control failed previousl...)

Date: Feb 28, 2005

You people just don't get it! ED, teaching, and research are not incongruous. Your attacks on ED are lame excuses for your lack of productivity. Spend less time in meaningless meetings and whining on this board, and perhaps you could be more productive.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Machiavelli
"You people just don't get it! ED, teaching, and research are not incongruous. Your attacks on ED are lame excuses for your lack of productivity. Spend less time in meaningless meetings and whining on this board, and perhaps you could be more productive."

Meanwhile, Shelby has driven away some of the most productive and internationally-respected scholars associated with USM (including Gary Stringer and Noel Polk, to mention just two).

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: View from a Distance
"I said it before, I'll say it again. Research dollars do not decrease the demand for academic dollars. Research is by law (and in reality) non-profit. "

Yes, research usually costs a university money. Shelby, of all people, should understand this. Of course, this is if you conduct research ethically.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

Well:

Mr. USM Sympathetic-- You really DO NOT consider Noel Polk or Gary Stringer scholars I hope!

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Machiavelli
"Your attacks on ED are lame excuses for your lack of productivity. Spend less time in meaningless meetings and whining on this board, and perhaps you could be more productive."

Thanks Mac. There really are people who believe this way. I wish they would help me understand the difference in lame excuses and the other kind. I suspect it has to do with who is speaking and who is listening.

Unless one is building widgets, productivity can be difficult to measure. I certainly would be loathe to measure the productivity of educators. I would be skeptical of any statement coming from the administration about the productivity of the USM faculty. Oddly enough, I don't remember SFT being publicly critical of faculty production; it's only the trolls beating that dead horse. Maybe SFT is exhorting the trolls privately.

There was another up-thread comment, "The general public sees you all as whiners." I am skeptical. Who is this fellow Johnson to measure the perception of the general public? In a totally unsolicited comment, the parking lot attendant where I work asked me how the president at USM could be "having fun" while the university is deteriorating beneath him. This from a guy whose only interest in USM heretofore has been how the athletic team of the season is doing at any given time.

I will be so bold to say that the general public thinks this whole Daddy and Dana thing stinks to high heaven. Refute that Mr. J. Then we can stand toe to toe and say, "Sez who?" and "So's yer mama."

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: truth4usm/AH
" Yes, research usually costs a university money. Shelby, of all people, should understand this. Of course, this is if you conduct research ethically. "

This has actually been raised with the administration but hasn't been received very favorably! Another widely accepted public untruth.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: The Poet
"Well: Mr. USM Sympathetic-- You really DO NOT consider Noel Polk or Gary Stringer scholars I hope!"

As a matter of fact, I very much do -- as do their scholarly peers throughout the world. What exactly are YOUR qualifications for doubting their stature?

Date: Feb 28, 2005

You all are mud wrestling with a pig. You are going to smell so bad that no one will let you in the house. Go work on research or go annoy your dean or think about where you are escaping to on Spring break. That would be much more productive and you would not have to cleaned up with a brillo pad.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: The Poet
"Well: Mr. USM Sympathetic-- You really DO NOT consider Noel Polk or Gary Stringer scholars I hope!"

This has to be a plant. How in heaven's name did "the poet" pick these two names out of the hundreds of scholars/researchers at USM? Someone either put him/her up to it or "the poet" is in the administration.

To The Poet--look at MSU's web site if you want to learn about Polk. Look at his publication record. Then look at last week's thread "for whom the bell tolls" if you want to know about Stringer's reputation in the great big world of world class academics and scholars.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Dr. USM SympaTHETIC
"This has to be a plant. How in heaven's name did "the poet" pick these two names out of the hundreds of scholars/researchers at USM?"

Betcha a dime to a doughnut that Mr. Johnson loves limericks and that his deepest reading material is People Magazine.

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Frowny Face
" Betcha a dime to a doughnut that Mr. Johnson loves limericks and that his deepest reading material is People Magazine."

Oooh, Frowny, don't diss limericks! Some of our best fun on the old FS board was the limericks. Right, folks?

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Retired prof
"Oooh, Frowny, don't diss limericks! Some of our best fun on the old FS board was the limericks. Right, folks?"

Yes. Who needs John Donne scholars when what we need is limrick writers. After all, isn't our new mission that of having FUN? Let's have a limerick thread!

Date: Feb 28, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Retired prof
"Oooh, Frowny, don't diss limericks! Some of our best fun on the old FS board was the limericks. Right, folks?"

There once was a troll who did feel
For Shelby a definite zeal:

"Old Shelby's my pal!
All the rest go to hell!"
But we all doubt ol B.J.'s for real.